What Are the Marks of a True Disciple?

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Permalink Reply by Richard L. Broch, Sr. on March 11, 2011 at 4:22pm

Greetings Brothers and sisters in Christ,

Let me start by saying there are some great posts being posted on this subject, amen. Thank you L.T. for making it possible.

 

Let`s focus on some points of supporting the marks of a true disciple.

We talk about the initial need, or requirement, to surrender one`s heart to Jesus. Right. How about adding a more complete measure of UNCONDITIONAL SURRENDER to Him, and we can use His words - one`s heart, and soul, and mind, in loving God, plus the neighbor as one`s self. Unconditional surrender demands giving up anything and everything to God, not keeping things for self (like Ananias and Sapphira).

 

It seems to me we don`t hear enough about "repentance" before starting our walk with our Lord. Repentance - #3340, "Pious sorrow for unbelief and sin, and turning from them unto God and the Gospel of Christ." Isn`t that like unconditional surrender?

I find Jesus` words interesting in Acts 26:18,"to open their eyes so that they may turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God, in order that they may receive forgiveness of sins and an inheritance among those who have been sanctified by faith in Me."

Notice He says AFTER they turn from darkness to light (repent), THEY MAY RECEIVE FORGIVENESS, and then an inheritance ( justification, righteousness), and then enter into the sanctification mode, ( showing the marks of a true disciple ).

 

Look at the emphasis on this matter of repentance before anything else - Matthew 4:17," From that time Jesus began to preach and say,"REPENT, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." Acts 2:38," And Peter said to them,"REPENT, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for FORGIVENESS of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

Psalm 51:17," The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit; a broken and contrite heart, O God, Thou wilt not despise."

 

What are we saying here?

Maybe there are some disciples in the ranks who have not truly repented unto God. If that that be the case, they have not been forgiven, but they`re going through the motions of a true disciple. They`d be the ones proclaiming "Lord, Lord,......" that Jesus is talking about in Matthew 7:21-23. They`d be the "fearful" in Revelation 21:8. 

We can`t tell a person`s heart, but God can. That`s why Jesus tells us not to be judging folks, He`ll take care of that department.

 

So, we must be forgiven before showing true marks of a true disciple, and we can`t be forgiven until we truly repent.

 

Grace and Peace.

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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on March 11, 2011 at 4:31pm

Richard,

 

Well said!

Lord Bles,

LT

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Permalink Reply by ScribeD on March 14, 2011 at 12:06am

Richard, I'm going to challenge you and hope you receive it with grace.

 

Let us be careful with not going beyond the Word with our definitions of things like "Repentance" and using the term "surrender". Jesus does not require total surrender as in the "submission" as the Muslims teach about Allah. Islam is a perversion that the church often falls into. Rather, Jesus requires Godly Repentance. We could spend an entire month discussing the difference, but let us just begin with an understanding that the "submission" of Islam is a perversion of God's truth. Islam requires "total surrender and submission".

 

To suggest that a person has the capacity to fully and unconditionally surrender, in themselves, is not taught by the Lord. If it were so, there would be no need for the sacrifice of the cross, nor of the Holy Spirit's indwelling.

 

Further, the sin of Annanias and Sapphira was not for failing to give "everything to God" nor for "keeping things for self". Peter clearly says they were punished for "Lying to the Holy Spirit" . In fact, Peter indicates that all would have been well if they had kept the land for themselves when he said "Didn't it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn't the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied to men but to God." (Acts 5:4)

 

So, let's be careful not to go beyond the Word. It will get us in trouble and become a tool of the devil to lead us to think of our relationship with God in wrong terms.

 

The situation of Psalm 51 is David's rebellious and selfish sin against Uriah (and ultimately against God). David was a believer, who knew his sin was a smack in the face of God. He knew Uriah was a Godly and faithful man, who put the needs of his Lord and his nation ahead of his own. He was also apparently a very Godly and humble man. David should have been an example of this kind of character, and he knew it. Instead, David selfishly stole from Uriah and then had him killed. God took offense at David's blatant selfishness and cruelty - especially because David knew better. However, God forgave him. Psalm 51 is David's heart cry of recognition that he failed and needed God's total cleansing to renew the right heart and the blessed relationship that He already had with his God.

 

Jesus is saying in Matthew 7:21 that he "never knew" the people referenced there.  This is not at all the same situation as David's in Psalm 51.

 

Lastly, you said "we must be forgiven before showing true marks of a true disciple, and we can`t be forgiven until we truly repent." But, Richard, if you look at all of the New Testament scripture, you will see that from God's perspective, your forgiveness was granted by Christ on the Cross. In finality and completion. So, this statement is not how God sees our situation at all. I challenge you to really consider your understanding of the term "Repent" used by Jesus in the Gospel. Strip away what men have said, and hear what the Lord says.

 

The true marks of a disciple (that is a true student of Jesus) is first to actually believe His Word. To Learn it. To comprehend what He has said is true and believe it is true, not allow our understanding to be subject to human thoughts or "conventional wisdom". If we add to, or take away from His Word, then we have missed the point of being a true disciple. We dare not attempt to remake the Gospel into an image we create.

 

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Permalink Reply by sayness on March 14, 2011 at 1:40am

HI nice discussion.. can I have a favor? Brethren I'm asking your permission, I'd like to post your thoughts on my facebook and tag my Christian friends.. Is it okay?
Waiting for your replies

GOD bless u all in Christ mighty Name

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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on March 14, 2011 at 7:28am

Sayness,

 

I cannot speak for everyone in this forum, but I have no problem with you sharing what is said by me.

 

Lord Bless,

LT

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Permalink Reply by ScribeD on March 15, 2011 at 12:38am

go for it.

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Permalink Reply by David Velasquez on March 15, 2011 at 7:41am

Fo sure girly. :)

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Permalink Reply by Sharon on March 31, 2011 at 12:25pm

dont use mine please

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Permalink Reply by Rita Cullimore on March 14, 2011 at 5:13am

In reference to Ananias and Sapphira, in Matthew 16:19 Jesus gave Peter the power to bind and to loose

¹⁹ I will give you ^mthe keys of the kingdom of heaven, and ⁿwhatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed⁴ in heaven.”

Peter exercised this as he reprimanded Ananias and Sapphira. We all have been given that same power, but when we use it,  we probably are using it without knowing that it is in our power to do so. This is one of the reasons that we have been warned about the power of our tongue, that we can kill or make alive by what we say.

 

As we study the Word, we reference the Old Testament and it leads us into confusion because it is an example of the Law. Once again I remind us that we aren't under the law, but under Grace. We need to strive to live by the New Testament, written in the time of Grace, to fully understand how we are to live and to understand what power we have because the Holy Spirit lives in us.

Blessings,

Rita

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Permalink Reply by Richard L. Broch, Sr. on March 14, 2011 at 9:09am

Greetings Sayness,

I have no problem sharing my written statements.

Thank you for asking.

 

Grace and Peace.

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Permalink Reply by OldPilot on March 14, 2011 at 10:04am

A disciple will take up their cross and follow Jesus, you will need to be dead to yourself to be alive and we need to get our faith to work for Jesus.

 

I told this during an adult bible class the other night, “if someone was giving one million dollars away to anyone at the local gas station you would tell anyone and everyone. Yet we have news of a Gift that is greater than all the money in the world and we are hesitant to tell anyone.

 

What Gift is greater than life, especially life eternal….that is why I think that a disciple takes up their cross, becomes dead to their self interest and works on the Great Commission that Jesus gave to the Apostles. We will fall short of the Glory but we need to continue to try and improve…we only need to plant the seeds God will do the germination and sprouting.  God Bless (below are some comforting bible verses)

Take Up Your Cross

Luke 9:23 Then He said to [them] all, "If anyone wants to come with Me, he must deny himself, take up his cross daily, and follow Me.

Dead to yourself

Romans 6:4 Therefore we were buried with Him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, so we too may walk in a new way of life.

 

Faith to work for Jesus

James 2: 26 For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

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Permalink Reply by ScribeD on March 15, 2011 at 12:44am

Dear OldPilot,

 

I think we need to learn to disciple people the way Jesus did. He didn't get to the take up your cross part until he had trained the disciples for more than a year. One year of that was a daily training. He had taught them the love, mercy, truth and grace of God in amazing ways before coming to that.

 

Yes, as a mature believer, you know you should take up your cross and follow him. The fellow who has never been to church has no idea why he should commit himself to a dead Jew that way. You see, Jesus didn't say that to John and Peter until well after he had developed a relationship with them that fully and completed transformed them with divine grace.

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