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Tribulation Saints
OK Guys and Gals,
Help me! Who are the Tribulation Saints?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by john bailey on
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Hi Ron, Thank you for your kind words. I must admit that although I am new in my faith, I have always enjoyed learning about and studying end times prophecy. I did not get the email acknowledgement, I guess you turned everything off before it went through. Feel free to send it at your convenience. Here is some scripture that leads me to believe that the Gentiles will be saved during the Tribulation
Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away. And there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened. And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books.
The sea gave up the dead who were in it, and Death and Hades delivered up the dead who were in them. And they were judged, each one according to his works. Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.” (Revelation 20:11-14)
“Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth – to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people – saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.” (Revelation 14:6-7)
“After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, and crying out with a loud voice, saying, “Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!” … Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, “Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?” And I said to him, “Sir, you know.”
So he said to me, “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His Temple. And He who sits on the throne will dwell among them. They shall neither hunger anymore nor thirst anymore; the sun shall not strike them, nor any heat; for the Lamb who is in the midst of the throne will shepherd them and lead them to living fountains of waters. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes.” (Revelation 7:9-17)
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Permalink Reply by Ron Payne on
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Hi John,
Yes, no doubt, you are studying. That's great! But John you misquoted the most important verse to prove your point.
"These are the ones who come out of (the) great tribulation"
The correct wording is: Came out of great tribulation - Persecutions of every kind.
the "great tribulation", out of which they came, is not to be reckoned to any particular time of trouble, but includes all that has been...still is..... or shall be; times of tribulation.
Similar to all the afflictions of the saints under the Pharasaic Jews; where Christians experienced persecutions, when they preached Christ as the Messiah; and their persecutions during the period of the Romish apostasy, in general all the afflictions, reproaches, persecutions, and many tribulations of all the saints, including every member of Christ in this world, who will have come out of all the world's troublesome times and their own particular time of tribulation... These then are those from every nation on earth, Jew and Gentile that looked to the cross and had their sins washed by the blood of the lamb. No man could number them.
Keep in mind that this period spoken of: "And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened." is at the Judgment throne and there are those that no man could number from every tribe and nation who had been given robes because they washed their robes, Not in THE great tribulation but during all the hardships and times of tribulation that they themselves had experienced during their life times. Almost all of the Apostles became Martyrs.
An important fact to remember is that the Bible cannot contradict itself.
If it says that the Just shall live by faith then it can never be by sight.
As I said earlier, Gentiles after the rapture, having seen their Christian friends vanish, planes crashing etc. etc, will believe what their Christians friends said. But will have lost the ability to exercise the faith, necessary to become Born Again. It is too late.
Some have said that the Holy Spirit's work amongst all Gentile nations will have been concluded and the Spirit's
task will now be to go to repair their hearts to once again rconclude the promises that God gave to Abraham. The Jew has basically not been left out of the promise that ALL nations will be blessed. Gentiles had their opportunity, now it's the Jews time.
As they say: "Seeing is believing", but that is not faith. I believe these folk will build up a resentment against Christ and that is why they will be so easily mislead by the AntiChrist.
Have a great day or night.
Blessings
Ron
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Hi Ron, Its morning here in the States and I am stuck at work. Let me ask you this. What about the ministry of the two witnesses of Revelation 11. If these are two men preaching to people, isn't their goal to help people to repent and be saved both Jew and Gentile?
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Hi John,
most, if not all of the world's theologians are lost on this one in regard to the identity of the Two witnesses. Some say that they are Elijah and Moses, but none of them are sure as to their real identity.
It appears that their role is not so much to preach but to declare God's Sovereignity over the world. Obviously they are in Satan's way and the people themselves wish that the witnesses were dead. Possibly these people are those who missed the Rapture and having turned to Satan, no longer want to hear anything the witnesses have to say. Hence at the death of the witnesses the world rejoices: "And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth. Rev 11:10
The word "torment" is obviously not preaching salvation to anyone but rather threatening them that God's day of Judgment is right on their doorstep.
Hope that helps John.
Enjoy your day at work. It is near bedtime for me.
Ron -
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Permalink Reply by Stacey Osana Arquines on
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Hi Brother John,
I will be the last to go :) <3
Lots of Love in Christ.
No one left behind.
In Jesus name I pray amen.
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Hi Stacey,
I hope no one is left behind either. When the Rapture does occur and we are taken to Heaven, I hope to meet you. Your posts are all so nice. It brings a smile to my face when I read them
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Hi Brother John :)
yes and I hope all come to Father, for I am not one to be behind the ones who do not love GOD back. with this said, pray pray pray por favor :) <3
I am glad you enjoy my posts I thank God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit :) <3
I hope to always be someone who can make you smile :) if not me then smile for Jesus :) <3
L.o.L. in Christ
<3 :)
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I do believe I am an exact copy lol I could be wrong what do yall think I wouldnt mind getting feed back from this.
I do see God allllllllllllllllllllll the time and his voice is very very very clear to me :)
I do talk to Jesus alllllllllllllllllllll the time he is in me like literally lol
And when I was 5 two dogs knocked me down and now I am left with a mark on my forehead I hide it with my bangs tho.
I am pretty much pure lol
I can prove all of this and I have witnesses :)
<3 :)
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Hi Stacey,
God made you exactly the way he wanted you to be.
I have found some beautiful and wonderful people amongst those who do not look like film stars, but whom I have admired and even been Jealous; of their lovely nature and Joy that they have.
Looking at your picture I see a beautiful young lady, worthy of a fine young man who may one day be your husband. Just make sure that he too is a Christian.
Lotsa Christian Love
Ron
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Hi Margie,
I am afraid that I cannot see how your description of the 144,000 fits in with that of the Bible
You say:
Should we not seek, by God's grace, to have that kind of character? Then could it be that God might choose us to be among the 144,000?
I do not believe that these virgins are men and women who have been selected by God as pure virgins.
The Bible says"
"These are they which were not defiled with women;" "These were redeemed from among men." Rev 14:
Again you say:
Christ's loyal, true, faithful church is represented as a virgin, a "pure, unfallen woman" And the individual members of God's church are represented as virgins: Matthew 25:1
Your quotation taken from Mathew 25 is not a good choice because it is a parable about women (not men) and half of them were foolish women, who were neither wise or steadfast.
The following verses you use as a reference to the 144,000 is also a poor choice in your article.
Isa 54:5 "For thy maker is thy husband
Isa 54:6 "For the Lord has called thee as a woman
Because verses have words like husband and woman in them, it cannot be assumed that God is simply referring to a group of 144,000. Therefore you have Isaiah 54:5-6 terribly out of context.
The whole passage of Isa 54 speaks of the period when God once again gathers the entire
nation of Israel during the Tribulation period. Sadly you never read the whole passage. Had you carried on reading you would have realised that God refers to the present period where the Jews have been forsaken (verse 7 and partly 8) and then in the last part of verse 8, God speaks of His mercy towards Israel.
Read it again with verse 5 and 6 together:
Isa 54:5For thy Maker is thine husband;
Isa 54:6 For the LORD hath called thee as a woman
Isa 54:7 For a small moment have I forsaken thee; but with great mercies will I gather thee.
Isa 54:8 In a little wrath I hid my face from thee for a moment; but with everlasting kindness will I have mercy on thee, saith the LORD thy Redeemer.
I can go on, but which ever verse you quote, appears that you have simply snatched verses out of the Bible to prove a theory, but sadly the verses are taken right out of context.
Another example. You ask Christians the following:
Are you really pure in heart? Do you love the beautiful? Can you say, "I love righteousness and hate iniquity?" Hebrews 1:9
But Hebrews chapter 1 verse 9 is not a question that is asked of Christians, neither is it a question.
It is purely a statement from God as he speaks about the attributes of Jesus Christ the Son of God:
"But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows." Hebrew 1:8-9
Please forgive me if I appear to be harsh, but sometimes a quick hard pull on a dislocated finger, straightens it out, whereas a Band aid strip never helps. Also I could have simply ignored the mail, but the reason why we are here at AAG is to discuss and help. I trust that you will take my comments in that light and not see it as an attack on you or your faith.
Believe it or not, I am your friend, simply trying to help.
Ron
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