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Trinity
I want to know more about the existences of this trinity and some fact to proof it from the scripture. Thanks
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Permalink Reply by Hellofull on
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Dear Carla,
If the knowledge revealed amongst you contradicts what is written in the Holy Scriptures, such knowledge is definitely not the truth revealed by the Holy Spirit.
As to your question about the Holy Spirit, we should let the Bible answer such question.
“But the Comforter, the Holy Spirit whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I have said to you.” (John 14:26, New King James Version)
Christ promised that God would send the Holy Spirit as the Comforter of His people. Christ also said that He Himself would send the Holy Spirit which is also called the Helper and the Spirit of truth (John 15:26). Being sent by God and Christ, the Holy spirit cannot be God, as what the Trinity doctrine stipulates, for the one who is sent is not greater than the one who sent him (John 13:16).
How else does the Bible describe the Holy Spirit?
The power of God (Acts 1:8) that He sends to help us in our weaknesses and infirmities (Rom. 8:26) and to strengthen us so that we can withstand our many trials in life and still remain rooted to our faith:
“I ask God from the wealth of his glory to give you power through his Spirit to be strong in your inner selves, and I pray that Christ will make his home in your hearts through faith. I pray that you may have your roots and foundation in love, so that you, together with all God’s people, may have the power to understand how broad and long, how high and deep, is Christ’s love.” (Eph. 3:16-18, Today’s English Version)
This prayer of Apostle Paul, especially its last few lines, is also my prayer for you and for all others who seek the truth that leads to salvation. May God continue to enlighten you and bless you.
And regarding what you said in your other post:
I would like to know how long you have been studing the scriptures? You seem very religious!!! Jesus calls us to a life that has nothing to do with religion. What church do you go to? Do you think that only a certain denomination will receive eternal life? Does your belief involve that there is a certain 'work' that you have to do to receive Eternal Life?
There is freedom in Christ!
What do you mean by religion?
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Permalink Reply by Carla on
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Dear Hellofull,
I should have been more specific in my question to you?
If the Trinity is not biblical (as you are saying).....who is the Holy Spirit? I guess I want to know what role The Holy Spirit has played in your life personally? What does it mean to you to have the Holy Spirit? What is your testimony of Him?
You see... I love discussing the scriptures.. I love discussing Jesus, and I love discussing The Holy Spirit. However, once I have done my studying, and I set my bible down...the scriptures are imprinted on my heart... They come alive in my life. I can say with assurance, that God is in control, and He loves me, He cares about the smallest details in the lives of His children.....He brings to remembrance for me all that I have studied at the time when I need it...to encourage, convict, teach, comfort, and guide me. God is revealed through His Word....but He is revealed relationally also.
It's all about Jesus... His Glory to God the Father! When I spend time soaking in Him... There are times when I am so convicted of sin....that I weep over His love and forgiveness towards me. The overwhelming feeling of How Great this Love is floods me....so beyond my understanding and comprehension...but very very real!
How do you translate this?
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Dear Carla,
I believed your question about the Holy Spirit has already been answered in my previous post. That's the role of the Holy Spirit in my life. In addition to what have already been posted are these verses:
"In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory." (Ephesians 1:13-14, NKJV, emphasis mine)
"And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into your hearts, crying out, "Abba, Father!" (Galatians 4:6, NKJV).
I feel the Holy Spirit especially when I pray and attend worship services to God. The Holy Spirit comforts me, strengthens me and gives me understanding.
About your experiences, let us take, as an example the testimony of Apostle Paul.
"Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is that they may be saved. 2For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge. For they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God." (Romans 10:1-3, NKJV, emphasis mine)
"Dear brothers, the longing of my heart and my prayer is that the Jewish people might be saved. "I know what enthusiasm they have for the honor of God, but it is misdirected zeal. For they don't understand that Christ has died to make them right with God. Instead they are trying to make themselves good enough to gain God's favor by keeping the Jewish laws and customs, but that is not God's way of salvation." (Romans 10:1-3 LB, emphasis mine)
We know for the fact that Israel was the first nation or people of God (Deut. 7:6), but because of there transgressions they have been departed from God, thus they are no longer considered God's people (Daniel 9:11). In the verses quoted above, Apostle Paul being a Jew, you can feel his love for them. He even testified that He knows what enthusiasm or zeal they have for God. Don't you think those Jews shed tears and weep as they perform sacrifices to God?
But what did Apostle Paul further explains about them? What they do is not according to the knowledge, for they being ignorant of God's righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness (Rom 2:3). God's righteousness is the Gospel of Christ the power of God to salvation (Rom. 1:16-17). Instead of following such, other Jews seek to establish their own righteousness.Other Jews still follow the law of Moses and reject the Gospel of Christ, when if fact the law of Moses is only up to John the Baptist (Luke 16:16).
Therefore, salvation is not about what we feel, what we sacrifice and what we do for God. It's about making sure that what we sacrifice and do to worship and praise God is in accordance to His righteousness (Rom. 1:16-17). It is important that our faith is based on the words of God, and not based on what we felt, dreamed or daydreamed about.
That is why the Apostles taught as not to believe every spirit, but test them.
"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world." (I John 4:1 NKJV).
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Dear Hellofull,
Here you go again taking verses out of context.....
I agree that we are not to believe every spirit...but to test everything! When comments such as yours so blatantly do not align with scripture.....the testing is easy. At this point the testing is done.. I think I speak for everyone here when I say we want you to see truth....repent and believe.
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Further Scriptural Evidence of Jesus’ Deity.
Creator:
ISA 40:28 Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God, the LORD, the Creator of the ends of the earth
JN 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
Savior
ISA 45:22 "Turn to me and be saved, all you ends of the earth; for I am God, and there is no other.
ISA 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
JN 4:42 And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world.
Raise the Dead
1SA 2:6 The LORD killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up.
JN 5:21-23 For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will. 22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: 23 That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
Judge
JOEL 3:12 Let the heathen be wakened, and come up to the valley of Jehoshaphat: for there will I sit to judge all the heathen round about.
JN 5:27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
Light
ISA 60:19-20 The sun will no more be your light by day, nor will the brightness of the moon shine on you, for the LORD will be your everlasting light, and your God will be your glory. 20 Your sun will never set again, and your moon will wane no more; the LORD will be your everlasting light, and your days of sorrow will end.
JN 8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.
I Am
EX 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
JN 8:58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
Shepherd
PS 23:1 The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not want.
JN 10:11 I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
Glory of God
ISA 42:8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.
JN 17:1 These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father, the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: JN 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
First and Last
ISA 41:4 Who hath wrought and done it, calling the generations from the beginning? I the LORD, the first, and with the last; I am he.
REV 2:8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write; These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive;
Bridegroom
ISA 62:5 For as a young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee: and as the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall thy God rejoice over thee.
HOS 2:16 And it shall be at that day, saith the LORD, that thou shalt call me Ishi; and shalt call me no more Baali.
REV 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
Rock
PS 18:2 The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer; my God, my strength, in whom I will trust; my buckler, and the horn of my salvation, and my high tower.
1CO 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
Forgiver of Sin
JER 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
MK 2:7 Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?
MK 2:10 But that ye may know that the Son of man hath power on earth to forgive sins, (he saith to the sick of the palsy,)
Worshiped by Angels
PS 148:2 Praise ye him, all his angels: praise ye him, all his hosts.
HEB 1:6 And again, when he bringeth in the first begotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
Creator of Angels
PS 148:5 Let them praise the name of the LORD: for he commanded, and they were created.
COL 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Confessed as Lord
SA 45:23 I have sworn by myself, the word is gone out of my mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That unto me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.
PHP 2:11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Regarding Jesus’ Preexistence:
1CO 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ.
Jesus is Immutable
HEB 13:8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and today, and for ever.
These are but a few more verses beyond the ones already posted that attest to the Deity of Jesus. Jesus is not just the plan of God, but God who fulfilled the plan.
• All Scripture used was from the KJV.
LT
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Dear LT,
Here are some of the verses you have quoted.
“Hast thou not known? hast thou not heard, that the everlasting God, the LORD, the Creator of the ends of the earth, fainteth not, neither is weary? there is no searching of his understanding.” (Isaiah 40:28, King James Version)
It is true, and it is written that the Father is the Creator of all.
“But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.” (I Corinthians 8:6, Ibid, emphasis mine)
“Have we not all one father? hath not one God created us? why do we deal treacherously every man against his brother, by profaning the covenant of our fathers?” (Malachi 2:10, Ibid, emphasis mine)
We cannot read in these verses that the Son or Christ is the Creator. Even John 1:3 did not say that Christ is the creator. Here’s what is written in John 1:3.
“All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.” (King James Version)
We cannot read in the verse that Christ is God who is the Creator. Such doctrine is just a conclusion of those who believe that Christ is God. They made such conclusion because of the statement “All things were made by him.”
Why shouldn’t we accept such kind of interpretation of the said verse? Because such conclusion will contradict what is written in Colossians 1:15. We know that there are no contradictions in the Holy Scriptures.
“Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:” (King James Version).
Apostle Paul proves that Christ is a creature and not a Creator.
Confusions about this verse arose because of the word “by” used by the King James Version. How is “All things were made by him” originally written in Greek?
“panta di’ autou egeneto” (The Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures). What should we understand first before we examined the Greek word used that was translated as “by” in English? The preposition “by” has three Hebrew term equivalent (Learning To Read Greek New Testament by Ward Powers, p. 116). Such as:
1. “en” = (by means of; instrumental), when “en” is followed by a pronoun in dative case.
2. “hupo” = (the personal agent), when “hupo” is followed by a pronoun in genetive case.
3. “dia” = (intermediary), when “dia” is followed by a pronoun in genetive case.
If you have noticed from what we have quoted earlier (“panta di’ autou egeneto”), the “di’” there is a contraction of “dia” followed by “autou” which is a pronoun in the genetive case. Therefore, in English it means “intermediary.” What does intermediary mean? It means mediator (Meriam Dictionary, p. 266).
That is why how does the other translation rendered this verse to avoid confusion.
“…through his intermediate agency…” (Wuest Version)
“All things were made through him” (Revised Standard Version)
What is the reason why it is said “All things were made through him”? “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;” (I Timothy 2:5, King James Version). Because being the Mediator between God and man, Christ mediates men to God. Here in these verse, it is even made more clear that there is only one God, and the mediator between God and men, is a man in nature.
Thank you so much for bringing up these verses. Once again you have proven that the Father is the only true God who created us all. And Christ is the man who will intercede on our behalf to the Father. Keep up the good work posting verses LT, just avoid spamming though.
Respectfully Yours,
Hellofull
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COL 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. 19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.
The fullness of God dwells in Him. His the image, exact representation. God took on human flesh. This is clear. These things only substantiate that Jesus is God. I do not even need to address your comment on the word "by" for the passage, not the verse alone upholds the truth once again.
Regarding Malichi. The O.T. is not full enlightenemt first of all, but a portion of the whole. With that in mind, the Word still is not contradicting, but affirming. For there is only one Father who is part of the godhead, the Trinity. There is only one God and God is found in the triune godhead of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Pretty clear.
Regarding spamming. One cannot spam the Word of God when it is being used to refute error.
LT
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Hellofull,
Jesus claimed to be God and you refuse to see it.
Others claimed He was God and He never refuted their claim and you refuse to see it.
Others said He claimed to be God and He never refuted their comment and you refuse to see it.
There are many indirect evidences and direct evidences that you refuse to see.
How do you argue agains thte truth. You often take a verse by itself, use many out of context and culture. You quote from the version that closest exemplifies your point of view. These are dangerous techniques. You tell us to not go beyond what is written and do not trust man's interpretation, yet you do that very thing.
May God guide you into the light and truth regarding Jesus..
LT
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Dear LT,
It is written indeed in Colossians 2:9 "For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily;" (New King James Version). But nothing is written about God taking on human flesh. If we are to accept that the statement "For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" means Jesus is God, then all Christians would also qualify to be God.
"And to know the love of Christ, which passeth knowledge, that ye might be filled with all the fulness of God." (Ephesians 3:19, King James Version, emphasis mine)
Regarding Malachi. He never said there is only one Father who is part of the Godhead. God made it even more clear through prophet Isaiah that there is no other God besides Him.
"Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me." (Isaiah 43:10, King James Version, emphasis mine)
If you don't accept what Malachi and Isaiah said because for you the Old Testament is not full enlightenment, I will quote for you again what Apostle Paul teach about the true God.
"yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live." (I Corinthians 8:6, New King James Version, emphasis mine)
Hellofull
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For the Christian to be filled with the fullness of God is to be filled with the Son who is God.
1 Corinthians 8:6 demonstrates two who are one. This is even clearer when compared to the whole counsel of God's Word.
Isaiah 43:10, Jesus is not formed, but rather God took on flesh. God did not change, but clothed Himself in human flesh.
You again substantiate the points that Jesus is God very well. Thank you.
LT
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Dear LT
In I Cor. 8:6, Apostle Paul did not demonstrate two who are one in nature. This is what we can read in I Cor. 8:5-6.
"For even if there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as there are many gods and many lords), yet for us there is one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we for Him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things, and through whom we live." (New King James Version)
Isa. 43:10 does not teach anything about God taking on flesh. This is what we can read in the verse:
"You are My witnesses," says the LORD, "And My servant whom I have chosen, That you may know and believe Me, And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, Nor shall there be after Me." (New King James Version)
Both the prophets and the apostles did not teach nor substantiate points that Jesus is God.
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