Reading the Bible

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Seek on December 2, 2015 at 4:29am

Amen

Permalink Reply by Amanda on December 2, 2015 at 10:18am

Ananda,


In my POV, more modern translations are more accurate simply due to all the new knowledge that developed in the 20th century, pertaining to archaeology (unearthing manuscripts) and radiocarbon dating of those manuscripts as well as to the education of those who become biblical scholars and translators. Also, since finding the more ancient manuscripts, modern bibles are translated from those more ancient Hebrew and Greek manuscripts and it's believed that they are actually closer to the originals, not the ones that were used as the basis for translating the KJV. Yet, even in light of these things, I still read and trust the KJV because even though, as I see it, newer translations are more desirable for serious bible study, as LT has stated several times, the differences between the KJV and the newer versions/translations are minor. There's no real change in the doctrine and teachings of the bible.

Permalink Reply by ribbon on December 2, 2015 at 8:30am

I have my reasons and admit some is preference and for others it has to do with recognizing that some today have a clear agenda that determines how the words are translated in order to get a particular outcome.

I have read christian based books before and noticed that the author would sometimes use different bible version verses in the same book. I wondered why... and now I am wondering if its because of what you said about wanting a particular outcome. I also wondered why he didnt just use the same version.

Permalink Reply by Carla on November 26, 2015 at 9:19pm

Hi Seek,

I personally use the NASB as my favourite.  When I started studying it was the NLT....that one got me interested in knowing more, and as I learned more I moved to the NASB.  I still love the NLT though.

When I am looking closely at something though I will look at 3 or 4 different translations.

I generally don't use the KJV because I find it difficult to understand, but sometimes I refer to it.

It's mostly a matter of preference.  The teaching pastor at my church uses the NIV primarily, but regularly encourages us to search things out for ourselves and use different translations to do it.  I believe that using different translations helps us to have a deeper richer understanding of what we are studying.

When I come face to face with this type of potentially confusing verse I consult my Interlinear bible which gives a word for word translation.  It's a bit hard to read because it's backwards (right to left) rather than left to right.  In the interlinear Hebrew/Greek bible the direct translation of Isaiah 9:3 "For the yoke of his burden and the staff of his shoulder the rod of him oppressing him you have broken They rejoice before You the exult in the harvest as the as rejoicing when they divide spoil"

in the NASB it says "You shall multiply the nation, You shall increase their gladness; they will be glad in your presence.  As with the gladness of harvest.  As men rejoice when they divide the spoil."

The interlinear bible mentions 'multiplying the nation in verse 2 instead of verse 3.  But don't forget that chapter and verse are not inspired.

I think if we focus on the differences of the text we may just drive ourselves a bit crazy.  It's good to study different versions so that we can gain a broader understanding of context, message etc...but not to the point of becoming confused or overwhelmed.

We trust in God's providence that He is able to keep His word from corruption so that we will know the truth and the truth will set us free.

I'm reading Isaiah 9:3 "and not increased the joy" as a question.   As in.... 'Have you not increased their joy?'... of course You have..  That's a silly question.  The entire context of this verse and surrounding verses is about increasing their joy.

...my two cents. :-)  Blessings, Carla

Permalink Reply by Ananda Welikala on November 26, 2015 at 10:09pm

I wonder how, about 200 yrs or so back,  English speaking farmers, barbers, cobblers, carpenters, soldiers etc, etc read thier own Bibles , ( the KJV was the only English Bible available in that time), and understood the very words that we read today in the KJV Bibles.  I'm not saying that everybody was able to read the KJV because some poor folks in those days had no schooling.  But every child who went to any Christian church and attended a Sunday School class learned to read the KJV Bible.  Most children and adults learned to read, just so they could read the Holy Words of God.  

In our day,  all kinds of Bibles are churned out of printing presses, by the millions, just in order to make "things easy,"  for this "take-it-easy generation.  The result is that the Holy, LOFTY, Words of Almighty God get "watered down.  Some churches don't sing Hymns that contain the word BLOOD in them.  The Blood of Jesus Christ is too gory for them.

The ALL-knowing, All-powerful God has provided a Holy Bible with untarnished words for the English-speaking peoples of the word and that Bible is the KJV.  (Btw, even the NKJV has corrupted the KJV).

Pertaining to the "JOY" not being increased,  that is perfectly right.  How can we know that?  By reading the whole chapter to the end.  The last verse in the chapter says it all.

Permalink Reply by Seek on November 27, 2015 at 4:23am

The reason someone could understand the KJV when it was written is because it was written in King James English. We wouldn't be able to read the Hebrew version either even though those in the time it was written could read and understand it.

Permalink Reply by Seek on November 27, 2015 at 4:42am

Ananda, I started this discussion to find out whether there were actual changes made in newer versions because I wanted to know the truth of Scripture. I'm sure you also want truth though and not just what you were taught.

So laying in aside the version you were taught, consider this. Where did the KJV originate? From the apostles who were there? No. It originated from men who translated what the apostles actually wrote. So if you want the most accurate version, you'd have to read the original manuscripts written by the apostles and prophets. You'd have to learn ancient Greek and Hebrew. But there are word for word translations of the original manuscripts. So examine those exact translations against KJV and others. I did this somewhere in this thread on the Lord's prayer. And the NIV was true to the translation but KJV added text. It wasn't text that changed the meaning but it was added nonetheless, while NIV didn't add or remove anything from that part of Scripture.

In light of that, shouldn't it cause you to question why you were lead to believe only the KJV had value?

Permalink Reply by Leonard T on November 27, 2015 at 6:29am

Ananda,

You again make assumptions based on your bias. 

1) You assume that the reason the newer versions are printed is so that it will be easy. How about instead of easy we realize that it is simply understandable. Again ... do you read the 1611 version of the KJV or the 1880ish version that had the language revised at that time?

2) Language is not watered down simply because it is brought forward out of Victorian English to today's English. 

3) You imply that people do not sing hymns with the word BLOOD in them because they do not use the KJV. That is ridiculous. I use several versions and we still preach and teach about the blood of Jesus. Our hymns still include the blood of Jesus. Thus, not using the KJV does not mean one will ignore the blood of Christ nor does using the KJV guarantee that people will not ignore the blood of Christ.

4) If the KJV is perfect in its translation can you explain why the translators inserted the word "Easter" in the text? The Greek word there is "pascha." It is found 29 times in the NT. 28 times it is translated as Passover and the other sole time translated as Easter.

5) Pertaining to Joy ... read the immediate context before you attempt to apply the context from 18 verses away. Also, remember that the last verse is only the last verse because humans added verses and chapters to the Bible. In reality it is not the last verse or even a verse, but for man adding them numbers. Therefore it is not the last verse as if meaning the close of a chapter and adding emphasis by the author. The original continues on as a letter

Permalink Reply by Seek on November 27, 2015 at 9:41pm

As an aside, one of my favorites that's sung in my church. 

Permalink Reply by Amanda on December 2, 2015 at 10:32am

Ananda,

You posed,

I wonder how, about 200 yrs or so back, English speaking farmers, barbers, cobblers, carpenters, soldiers etc, etc read thier own Bibles , ( the KJV was the only English Bible available in that time), and understood the very words that we read today in the KJV Bibles. I'm not saying that everybody was able to read the KJV because some poor folks in those days had no schooling. But every child who went to any Christian church and attended a Sunday School class learned to read the KJV Bible. Most children and adults learned to read, just so they could read the Holy Words of God.

As I understand it, the first English language version of the full Bible was John Wycliffe's translation of the Vulgate in 1384. Several others also came forth before the KJV, and were English versions, such as the Great Bible (1535) and Bishop's Bible (1568).

Were they not the Holy Words of God?

Permalink Reply by Seek on November 27, 2015 at 4:28am

You do about the same as I do Carla. But NIV and NKJV are the ones I use the most. But I'd seen various quotes on differences and knew we're not to ad or take away and wanted to be sure if there had been some alterations made.

God can preserve the Word but the warning of adding or removing Scripture is there so we don't blindly accept what everyone claims to be the Word.

Permalink Reply by Carla on November 27, 2015 at 5:12am

Yes... that's absolutely right!  It's an important question.  It's also important to deal with the questions so doubts don't get the better of us.   It's good that you asked.  :-)

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