All About GOD - Growing Relationships with Jesus and Others
Is Christianity two-tiered?
Some Christians seem to struggle very much in the Christian life, and are at almost constant war with their flesh, often falling into sin (I'm talking here of sins like selfishness, anger, impatience etc).
Other Christians seem to be living in such glorious victory. They don't seem to give in to selfishness, impatience, anger etc.
When I look around, there seem to be two tiers in Christianity: Those who seem to have it easy must have either graduated into a higher tier of Christianity, or perhaps they're pretty self-controlled by nature or upbringing and so there's less work to be done.
Then there's those who have so little victory, though they want it.
My personal experience as a believer has been one of almost constant struggle. I feel my sin nature so keenly, and am most often in great temptation to live according to my flesh, often succumbing to the old habits of sin that come so easily to me.
I know the answer to our struggles in the Christian life is: FAITH. Maybe those who I imagine in the "upper tier" are simply those who have stronger faith.
If simple faith is the answer to those in the thick of the battle with their flesh, what does it looks like to apply simple faith to the daily failures and so little daily victory over sin?
Thanks in advance,
Jenny
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Mary O on
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Hi Jenny, God bless you!
IMO anyone can believe when things are going well. If things go well, then there isn't much challenge for to hang on to faith. It doesn't take that much effort. When things aren't going as well as we'd like and we insist on believing anyway, that's faith. This is what the Apostle Paul said...But He said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for My power is made perfect in weakness. "Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me. That is why, for Christ's sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong. (2 Corinthians 12:9,10 NIV)
Paul had the whole scope...weaknesses, he received insults, he experienced hardships, he was persecuted and had difficulties. He was resolved in his belief anyway. He said...I know whom I have believed.
That is why I am suffering as I am. Yet this is no cause for shame, because I know whom I have believed, and am convinced that He is able to guard what I have entrusted to Him until that day. (2 Timothy 1:12)
I can do all this through Him who gives me strength. (Philippians 4:13 NIV)
You can't help every temptation that comes your way. Things sometimes won't go the way we'd hoped. It takes a lot of belief and courage to approach God and say "You know, I messed up, and I'm sorry." All God ever wanted is our love. He wants us to seek His face and humble ourselves. He waits for a change of heart and spirit.
Love,
Mary
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Permalink Reply by Jenny on
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Thankyou Mary,
Even though I see little fruit and the battle is hard daily, I want to be His no matter what. And as you reminded me, His grace is sufficient for me, and its encouraging to know that choosing to stay with Him even when its difficult is a fruit of faith.
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Jenny,
I am going to post the outline of this coming Sunday's message. After I preach this message and the audio gets posted to our church website I will post it here if anyone desires to listen to it.
Lord Bless,
LT
Title: Deeper Walk with Jesus
Scripture: Exodus 33-34
Church: Family of God Fellowship
Date: August 3, 2014Theme: Our relationship with Christ has many levels as we will see today. He calls us to a deeper walk with Him.
I. Moses sought the Lord. 33:7-11
..A. Moses took the time to go to the tent to meet with the Lord.
..B. Moses did not stand on the outside, but entered in.
..C. God responded to the seeking Moses.II. Moses communicated with the Lord. 33:12-23
..A. Moses spoke to the Lord. Vv.12-13, 15-16
....1. He asked questions. Vv.13, 16
......a. No religious jargon, but simple conversation.
..B. The Lord responded. Vv.14, 17
....1. This is a dialogue, not a monologue.
....2. God granted Moses’ request.
......a. Notice God’s reason for answering Moses.
........1. God was pleased with him.
........2. God knows his name.
....3. They have a good relationship.
..C. They have an ever growing relationship. Vv.18-23
....1. Moses wanted to see God’s glory.
......a. He’s seen the burning bush.
......b. He was used in the 10 plagues.
......c. He has spoken to God on the mountain top.
......d. He has experienced God in the tent of meetings.
....2. Moses’ deep desire to know more of God.
......a. He recognizes that there is still more of God to experience.
......b. He hungers for that deeper relationship.
........1. God is pleased with his request.
....3. God reveals as much to Moses as a man can see and live.
......a. This newest experience is not a day one experience for Moses.
......b. Note that Moses was already walking with the Lord and yet a deeper more rich experience was available to him.
......c. His hunger for God has not waned, but is ever increasing.
......d. It follows a life that is ever surrendering to the will of God.
....4. Note: Once again we get a glimpse at Joshua.
......a. He is in the tent with Moses and God. V.11III. The results of the deeper experience as seen in Moses. Exodus 34
..A. Moses is called back to the mountain. V.2
....1. We have no idea as to how much time passed between the first and second trip.
......a. Moses went to the Tent of Meeting.
....2. God did not simply say “OK” all is good let’s move on.
......a. Time passed.
..B. The Lord’s proclamation to Moses. Vv.5-7
....1. The Lord is compassionate and gracious.
....2. The Lord is slow to anger.
....3. The Lord abounds in love and faithfulness.
......a. Maintaining love to thousands.
....4. Forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin.
....5. The Lord does not leave the guilty unpunished.
..C. Moses again intercedes. Vv.8-9
....1. Forgive our wickedness and our sin.
....2. Take us as your inheritance.
......a. Moses did not assume anything, but pleaded with God to take them as His.
....1. Moses understood the damage caused by sin.
..D. The Lord renews His covenant. Vv.10-28
....1. The covenant is conditional.v.11
......a. Obey … I will.
....2. The Lord reveals a list found in verses 12-28.
......a. He concludes with “the words of the covenant – the Ten Commandments.
..E. Evidence Moses had been in the Lord’s presence. Vv.29-35
....1. Moses was changed in such a way that all knew he had been in the presence of the Lord.
......a. His face was radiant.IV. Challenge
..A. We must recognize that our relationship with the Lord is progressive with many levels along the way.
....1. Level one: Met God
......a. Burning bush experience.
....2.. Level two: Obey God and used by God.
......a. Moses returned to Egypt and God used him.
....3. Commune with God.
......a. Mountain top/Tent of Meeting.
......b. This level in my opinion is rarely reached by most Christians today.
....4. Desire to see God’s glory.
......a. Deeper relationship.
......b. Not satisfied with yesterday, but want more of Him.
..B. The New Covenant.
....1. The new covenant is the blood of Jesus.
......a. Luke 22:20
....2. Like the Ten Commandments this covenant is conditional.
......a. You must believe, repent and receive.
........1. John 3:16
........2. Acts 2:38
........3. John 1:12
..C. Evidence that you have been with Jesus?
....1. Are you stuck at the burning bush?
....2. Have you moved from the burning bush to a life of obedience?
....3. Did your obedience and God using you lead to a deeper experience as we commune with Him?
......a. The doorway to the deeper communion is obedience (living for the Lord).
....4. Has all this led you to the point that anything less than all of Him will never satisfy?
....5. As people look at us do they see the marks and life of Jesus in us?
......a. Moses light was so bright he had to veil it.
......b. Too many today are still looking for the switch to turn the light on when the Lord has so much more for us.
......c. 2 Corinthians 3
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Permalink Reply by Amanda on
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I've never looked at the journey of faith for Moses in such depth, LT. I think the experience within relationships in general is a progressive one. That our relationship with God is often viewed differently has been confusing for me.
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Hi LT, I am watching for your Sunday message. Is there a way you could let us know when it's here?
Love,
Mary
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Unfortunately our sound guy had to leave mid-service and no one recorded the message. Time permitting I may put together an audio version for posting here.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Hi LT, God bless! If you can put it together, that would be awesome. I figure you're like me. I get on here before work and during breakfast. I just polished off a donut. Then at lunch time gobble down food and read and type and for a little while at night.
If it gets too much to record, what about a few discussions on the forum??? It's nice to interact on the net. Most of my computer work is typing long documents that are about like watching grass grow. So to use the computer for enjoyment is nice and Bible is a treat.
Love,
Mary
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Jenny, I hope you don't feel alone in your struggle, and it's not a struggle, IMO, that should be trivialized or minimized in anyway for anyone. The fact that you are concerned about your relationship with God is a very good sign. I think learning to trust God is an enormous part of the journey for many people. I even see trust in God developing in the life of Moses.
One of the questions that I continue to have is how will we know when we are doing something in our own strength or by His strength?
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Permalink Reply by Richard L. Broch, Sr. on
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Hi Jenny,
My personal opinion is that Christianity is many-multi-tiered...........seems that people are at many different degrees, levels, and stages.
Also, it appears that folks reach out, and step out in their faith, sometimes weakly, sometimes beautifully.
The late Oswald Chambers wrote an excellent short piece on " The Inspiration of Spiritual Initiative".
He starts off with - "Not all initiative , the willingness to take the first step, is inspired by God".
We know that initially, one is convinced by the Holy Spirit (Faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God........For we are saved by grace and not that of ourselves.......It is the gift of God.). That's when our walk with the Lord starts out.
Oswald says then," God does not give us overcoming life - He gives us life as we overcome." This is important.
Here's the meaning of that statement: In Exodus 14 :13-16 (paraphrased) The children of Israel are at the Red Sea with Pharaoh and his cavalry bearing down on them. Moses is telling everybody to chill-out and be cool......cause God's going to take care of them. Then God says to Moses, " Why are you crying out to me? Tell the sons of Israel to go forward. And as for you, lift up your staff and stretch out your hand over the sea and divide it............"
Point being - God told Moses to do something first......before He did anything.
II Kings, Chapter 5: Elisa sent word to the leper Naaman to go wash in the Jordan River seven times, to be clean of his leprosy. He had to get involved himself.......first.
In Matthew, Chapter 13, Jesus told the man with a withered hand , "Stretch out your hand." It was then healed.
In John 9:1-7, After applying a clay substance to the blind man's eyes, Jesus told him," Go, wash in the pool of Siloam."....and he gained sight.
Jenny, it's like walking up to an automatic-opening door...... we have to step up to a certain place before the door will open for us. If we stop short of the trip-point.........we'll stand there till the cows come home......and the door will never open.
Think Ephesians 5:14," For this reason it says, "Awake, sleeper, And rise from the dead, And Christ will shine on you."
So Sister, go for it.......remember that you have the in-dwelling Holy Spirit living in you.
Grace and peace.
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