All About GOD - Growing Relationships with Jesus and Others
What does sanctification look like?
So I posted a blog this morning: http://www.allaboutgod.net/profiles/blogs/what-does-sanctification-....
This brings the question we've gone around on many times here. Are we to rebuke satan against everything we endure? Are we to have faith that God does not want us sick or anything else and to stand on that and claim our healing and be healed because of our faith that God heals? Are we to ascribe all sickness and suffering as the work of the devil and that as children of God cannot touch us?
Or are we to allow sanctification to have it's perfect work in us? Sanctification which may come through trials and suffering and sickness that God allows to happen. Satan is the author of it, yet God is in control of everything and not man. For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor? Romans 11:34. I would rather stand on the belief that God wants me healed but that He wants me to shine, to be more like Christ, that He wants my INNER me healed above the outer physical me first than to stand cursing the devil and proclaiming that I'm already healed. I believe in Mark 11:24 wholeheartedly: Therefore I say unto you, What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
And I shall. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow. Am I healed? In God's timing, yes I am. And I'm not meaning to start a war on what we believe in, but my point is that God meets each of us where we are. What one may have faith in, they did not acquire overnight. Perhaps they already passed their sanctification point. Perhaps they believe wrongly. Only God knows these things, not I nor anyone else. But I say my faith is strong. I have not quit in spite of it all. But I HAVE BEEN changed....and that concerns God way more than whether my body is healed.
So perhaps we shouldn't be so quick to call down fire from heaven unless and until we know what God is up to?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Amanda on
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Roy,
My prayers are with your grandson. May you have a safe trip. Bring us back news of his recovering. As far as the cursed fig tree, I always thought it means God is harsh when we are fruitless. I also knew the fig tree in Scripture often represents Israel. I look forward to the rest of the story.
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Permalink Reply by RoyW on
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Thank you for your prayers. We are fruitful because of Him. His works are credited to us. Forgive me if I am just a bit lazy and rest here a little while. However, I will take His works over mine any day. I am going to ride His works all the way into heaven. Actually, I am not even going to do that. He will pick me up and carry me in. I love Him so much. Some of us are so weak we have to depend completely on Him.
I do believe I will be bringing back a good report from Denver. We leave at 2:30 in the morning. Blessings to you and all the rest.
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Thank you, Tammy. He is now an outpatient at the National Jewish Health Hospital in Denver. We are down here seeing them. Praise the Lord for these people that God called many years ago. They are getting this under control. He was greatly suffering with a severe case of eczema. No one was able to figure out how to treat it in Wyoming so here we are. I am very grateful that he is beginning to enjoy life again. I saw him smile yesterday for the first time ever. My son told me that we think we have control of our lives until something like this happens. These little ones have our hearts. They had taken him to several places even here in Denver before he was recommended to go see these people at this hospital.
Blessings to all.
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Permalink Reply by Tammy on
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I'm so glad they are getting a grip on this brother. May he be healed according to God's will & may He be glorified.
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As I continue, it is not my intent to be presumptuous about God's Word. There is so much to understand and we do see through a glass darkly. Not all will agree with this interpretation of Mark 11 and Matthew 21. I think it is worth considering.
It is pretty difficult to piece together the days of that last week as the ministry of Christ on this earth was coming to a close and the epic conclusion of our salvation was about to be finalized. Jesus would offer His precious back to those who would beat Him, His cheeks to those who would rip out His beard, His face to those who would spit on Him, and His hands and feet to those who would drive those nails through them. Our God would set His face like a flint towards that cross for He knew He would be vindicated by those who would believe and put their trust in Him. That is we. We are the ones that will quickly admit that it was our sin that put Him there on that cross. He died for us. We are the guilty ones. He was innocent.
He claimed to be God. He was convicted for that claim. That last week Jesus spent much time preparing His disciples for what lay ahead for them. He did warn them of the persecutions, the hate, the rejection and the trouble that was in store for them. If they would call Him Lord, they would suffer. He wanted them to find peace in the midst of trouble the same as He wants us to find peace. He spoke of peace often that week. Trouble was headed their way and He would not steer it away. Yet, in the midst of the storm, He wanted them to find peace.
Jn 14:27 Peace I leave with you; my peace I give you. I do not give to you as the world gives. Do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid. NIV
Jesus also spoke to them about fruit. His people must produce fruit. A fruitless life would be the sure sign that faith did not exist. The true believer can become consumed with that idea but the natural result of being connected to the vine is the production of fruit. Jesus told us that He would build His church. Producing fruit is not something that we can figure out how to do no more than we could have ever figured out how to get into this world. Producing fruit is a result of being connected to Him. It is not something that we do by effort. A flower just can't be anything other than a beautiful flower.
Jn 15:5-6 "I am the vine; you are the branches. If a man remains in me and I in him, he will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. 6 If anyone does not remain in me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned. NIV
At this point Jesus seems to revert back to that fig tree He had cursed just a couple days before. He goes on to say:
Jn 15:7 If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you. NIV
Ask what you will and it will be given you. The key here is our lives in Him. Jesus is speaking of a great organization that is going to produce that which He has planned from the very beginning of this world. The plan was set from that very first moment that Adam fell. What do we want? If only we could see deep within our hearts we could see it. I have raised five children and now have fifteen grandchildren here. You see things in their hearts that even they themselves do not see. Children in all their innocence want to please. Sure, they get excited to get things, but even more than that – they want to please.
Now, I teach school – more children. They want so much in life but there is this deep felt need in all of them to please their teachers and those in authority over them. We who belong to Him have that same feeling. More than anything in this world, we want to please Him. Jesus is well aware of this feeling within our hearts. Ask and it shall be done.
We go through this life thinking about all those things we want. We want a good life. We want everything this world has to offer. The more we get the more we want. We want what all those we know have and then maybe a little more. We go to God and ask Him to give us all those things. We see others getting these things and wonder why we don’t receive. We ask for so much and then wonder why we do not receive. Didn’t Jesus tell us that He would give us whatever we desired? Didn’t He say that whatever we say we could have it? There are certainly those who promote that kind of thinking. Just imagine how we could put that to work for all our wants. Haven’t we all asked for things that we did not receive? So much of what we have asked for all seems to be perfectly innocent. I asked Him for the healing of my grandson. I believe He wants to give that and is giving that. I have asked Him for so much. I ask Him for healing for those I love. I ask Him to bless all my efforts. I ask Him to bless my family. I ask and ask and ask and ask. No one will ever be able to accuse me of not having because I don’t ask. I have even asked Him to help my ball team win. I remember the time our Christian school team was in a national championship game. We were down in an impossible situation. We were competing against the top Christian school team in America. There didn’t seem to be a way to come out on top. Yet, everything that needed to happen did happen. We won that national championship. I have the plaque of my wall to prove it. I really don’t think He gets too upset with us when we ask Him for things we probably should not be asking for. Yet, sometimes He does say, “No.”
That is what some would like to change. Some would like to take from God the ability for Him to actually say, “No.” Notice, however, that Jesus is still talking to us about asking God – not telling God. God is in the business of answering our prayers. If you have been in the circles I have been in, you have probably heard people actually demanding that God do certain things. No, the Bible is very clear on this one. When we ask, we must ask according to God’s will. James points out that often we ask incorrectly and as a result don’t get what we ask for in prayer. Is it always God’s will to heal these fallen bodies? Paul found out that sometimes God says, “No.”
This post is getting pretty long. There is still so much yet to go to understand Jesus' Words here. Our prayer is to have greater understanding.
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Permalink Reply by Seek on
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Yeah, sometimes God says no, but there are those who shove that part aside in favor of the ask anything and you shall receive it. I brought up the bit about Paul's thorn to a Charismatic. His comment was that Paul wasn't asserting his authority and asking God instead of rebuking satan. YIKES!
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Yes, the part that is so troublesome is the confusion that sort of thinking causes. Invariably, we will ask something that isn't answered in the affirmative. Perhaps the person we are praying for dies or isn't healed from their infirmity. It happens to all of us. Some of the prophets of today defers that problem to the person to be prayed for. They will say that the individual doesn't have enough faith, has unforgiveness or something of that nature. You will notice, however, that it is mostly the apostle or prophet that is doing the healing - not so much the individual. There were a few times when the Jesus acknowledged the faith of the individual but most of the work done was done by Jesus or the apostles.
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Yes and yes. I cannot figure out how anyone overlooks that. No one was going around asserting authority and healing themself, but they were healing others. And Jesus healed many that couldn't even have faith. IE: The girl that was dead, the son in the coffin, Lazarus in the tomb. How could they have faith He would raise them if they were dead and incapable of thought? And to tell people they must not have enough faith is to downgrade them, NOT lift them up and encourage them.
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Roy,
It's fitting that you're sharing this study as Easter approaches. It's a blessing.
You wrote: "I really don’t think He gets too upset with us when we ask Him for things we probably should not be asking for. Yet, sometimes He does say, “No.”
When I have to say no to my child, often I feel sympathetic. I suppose many parents do, and that's why there are so many articles written about how to tell your child no in a positive way or, get this -- saying no without saying no --but the sympathy I feel is because I have to set boundaries and limits that are for the good of my child, while understanding that I have no control over how my child will react or feel or think when I must say no.
Yet, I do want, and sometimes even attempt to make my child feel ok with being told no.
God says no and we are at liberty to respond to that answer, perhaps with disappointment, sadness, anger, etc ...
We want our children to learn how to cope when they hear "no" because, out in the world, too, all of their lives through they will hear "no, you didn't get the job" "no, the treatment didn't work" "no, the relationship isn't working out."
God never says no to us without helping us and strengthening us to deal effectively with something difficult.
In my devotion this morning, the author made a distinction between knowing there's a God, believing God, and trusting God. Some people just accept the concept of God's existence but have no connection with God, while others believe in the one true God, accept and believe God's self descriptions in the Scriptures, believe the bible is infallible and without error, but still don't live in the peace that, no matter what, everything is going to be OK.
That is the place of trusting God.
It finally all clicked for me this morning -- the differences between simply knowing there's a God, believing God, and trusting God.
That's where I am -- learning to grow in trusting. Trusting. No matter what.
I've a lot of growing to do.
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I've a lot of growing to do.
We all do but I will say that I have seen tremendous growth in your life. You have a real spiritual insight to God's Word. It is wonderful to see.
I agree - when we learn to trust Him we can find rest for our weary souls.
In your comment about reacting to God - I think He would rather see us being real than acting all spiritual. Self-discipline is good but sometimes we need to tell God how we are really feeling. We might as well. He already knows anyway.
Great points -
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