Proverbs 18:21

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Permalink Reply by Seek on June 3, 2013 at 7:18am

I believe this is one of the biggest problems with Christians that believes that God will do everything for them, without them doing anything to bring it about

Could be, but it's not at all even close to what I was talking about. 

I could read every self help book under the sun, and if I wasn't relying on God, praying and expecting Him to work a change in me, I wouldn't change.  People pay thousands for self-help courses daily and are no different now than they were before they attended these courses.  People turn to scripture and God and change.  It is ONLY God who can change the inner man.

Further, what Amanda was speaking of further down about us all being at different levels of maturity and growing Christians, you went straight to the bit about MacArthur's commentaries, but I'm curious as to your comments on the growing and maturity levels as she stated it if you would. 

I can also understand why she would back out of the conversation.  Sometimes older more established Christians, or those who seem to have no struggles in life, come across as if others must need to learn something...kinda brushing off the younger Christians as if they don't know as much, or are incorrect simply because they're younger or newer to the faith.  It can make the newer/younger Christian feel as if they're words are unimportant.  But I think all of us can learn from each other, no matter what area we are in.  Some are so mature in their faith, they have simply forgotten what it was like to struggle and question and grow.

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Permalink Reply by Seek on June 4, 2013 at 6:04am

I could introduce you to some who claim to have never once doubted or been discouraged through struggles.  I often wonder just how honest they're being.  ;-)

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Permalink Reply by Seek on June 4, 2013 at 6:21am

I'm beginning to see that but for the longest time, those comments kept me thinking I was all wrong or didn't have enough faith or something.  I wonder if they've simply forgotten what it was really like, have never truly faced hard times, or are afraid to admit they too doubted, or perhaps they feel they need to preach it so others won't doubt.  But doubt and discouragement hits everyone I believe.

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Permalink Reply by Seek on June 4, 2013 at 7:20am

Yes, and I hope to one day get there.  I'm sure I will eventually.  But I also pray I NEVER forget what it was like so that when someone else needs encouraging, I'll be able to tell them that it's ok, and all a part of the process and they'll be fine.  Rather than tell them they should never doubt...let them know we all doubt at some points, but the longer we stand, the stronger we grow.

Permalink Reply by Vincent Hayden on June 4, 2013 at 2:56pm

'Thank you Grace. This is what I see as well. I see the same thing - 'The rain falls on the just and the unjust."

God tells me to strive toward perfection, but along the way, to accept myself as I am now.

The adversary is crafty, paganism has crept into every denomination I've seen, we need to rid ourselves of these deceptions for He says if you share in their practices, you share their curses.

Jeremiah 10:2-4 talks about christmas trees for example. It's more about not getting the reward than it is about punishment.

We are all still kids. There are still some whackos out there. I'm not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, but I am ashamed of how mankind has distorted the message. 

I think it's also important to remember that the more mature a person becomes, the more light shines through them and the darkness will fight them even more. This means that things get very difficult along the way and the doubts about one's salvation can spring up -

or maybe it's more like, 'did I do something wrong, did I open a door some how and invited demons into my space?' - maybe not, it could simply be spiritual oppression from the other side.

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Permalink Reply by Susan Ruth Lawing on May 29, 2013 at 9:14am

It means that I have had to pray the Lord Prayer, asking that He forgives me as I forgive those who have hurt me by gossiping about others, including my spouse. It has been the only thing that has set me free

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Permalink Reply by Vincent Hayden on May 29, 2013 at 7:01pm

I also have to ask Him to help me forgive myself as He forgives me, if I don't forgive and love myself it is nearly impossible to do so for others.

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Permalink Reply by JB on June 2, 2013 at 9:37pm

Amanda, I’m sorry you feel this way; I don’t believe we are quarreling about words, at least that is not my intentions, all I want to do is to discuss this subject with an open mind, so why are you backing out of it? I’m sure you are not afraid of the truth as it is so clearly spelled out in the Word of God. I would like for you to think about something; how do we learn, whether it be scripture or phone numbers? Usually it’s by repetition of quoting the verses, and numbers, or by meditating on them till they become etched on our mind that we won’t forget them. Psa.119:11 Says “Thy Word have I hid in mine heart, that I might not sin against thee.” This is how we renew our minds to the Word. His Word is more vital to us than the blood running through our veins, especially as far as eternal life is concerned. Just like the Ten Commandments; they are written on our hearts, so we don’t have to look at a list of them to see if we are in error. It’s the Spirit that quickens us to the Word, or the laws of God. Jo.14:26 says “But the comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your “remembrance”, whatsoever I have said unto you”, When we are enlightened of the truth, by reading or meditating on the Word, this is when the Spirit is talking to us. But when we try to understand it through our feelings, or emotions, it is not the Holy Spirit, but intellect, and we will have a distorted view, which will result in a wavering faith.  

You might think this to be out of context, but it can apply to other areas of our lives as well, Rom.1:29, There are those that know what they are doing: does not aligned with the Word, so to keep themselves from being brought under condemnation, they will not learn the truth; in other words it would be like taking the 5^th in a court of law. Please do not think I am saying this about you, I know you want the truth by what you write, but I hope you understand what I am trying to say. I love everyone on this forum, and the last thing I want to do is lead someone astray, if what I say doesn’t agree with your understanding, don’t just stop talking, let’s use scripture and discuss it, I’m here to learn as well.  

It is a good thing to keep our fellow Christians in remembrance of these things if we see them going astray, especially if we know the truth ourselves based on the Word and not what someone has told us, including me, I never expect others to take what I say as the ultimate truth, I always encourage them to look it up in the Word and let the Holy Spirit teach them, without a preconceived idea, based on what we see written by others on this or other subjects, has told us. I very seldom reference other preacher’s thoughts on any subject, as being the way I believe, until I study it out for myself and it becomes a reality to me as well, and I expect others to do the same with what I say.

I think I have mentioned this before, but I usually tell those I try to teach about anything, whether it be in the building business, or about bowling, “please don’t take advice from someone more screwed up than you are” including me. Please don’t take this as a personal attack either. Lol

Love ya Amanda, be blessed, amen?

JB

PS Amanda, on a personal note, I know you were communicating with Rita, as was I, She wrote me after she got out of the hospital, but she never did respond to my last letter. I tried to get her son Shane Harkin, on Facebook to let me know how she was getting along, but he never did respond, except to accept my request to be friends. I even tried to find out through a search in the City where she was in the hospital, but to no avail. Have you, or do you know anything about her? They were saying on Facebook to pray for Shane’s mother Rita, she was in ICU at that time, but never did say how she was getting along. Thank you, you may write on my personal page if you like.   

  

 

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Permalink Reply by Amanda on June 3, 2013 at 9:12am

I haven't communicated with Rita personally for a long while. The last activity she has had on AAG was May 14th. I continue to pray for her.

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Permalink Reply by Seek on June 3, 2013 at 9:15am

I forward her my jokes, but she hasn't responded to anything to me since Feb.  :-(

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Permalink Reply by Tammy on June 4, 2013 at 7:33am

JB,

I haven't read much of this discussion & don't even know what is being said as far as you & Amanda but I want to amen this comment. I have had it on my computer screen for 2 days so I thought I needed to read it & got up & read it this morning. I think this is awesome advice which I, too, follow. I try to look up everything & not take man's word for anything. Amen brother

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