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The Parting of the Ways- The split between Judaism and Christianity was gradual....
The Parting of the Ways
By Anne Amos
Introduction
... The split between Judaism and Christianity was gradual and happened at different rates in different places. There is remarkably little agreement among scholars as to what precisely caused the rift and estimates vary about the date, from the middle of the first century CE to the middle of the fourth CE.
Professor Alan Crown from Sydney goes beyond the reserve of most scholars and dates "the parting of the ways" to the Council of Nicaea 325 CE, a date which I accept. The Council of Nicaea was called by the Emperor Constantine to settle some theological differences that were dividing his Christian Empire. The first act of the three hundred bishops assembled was to set a date for Easter distinct from the Jewish Passover thereby effectively separating Jews and Christians. (continued on the following web page.)l and happened at different rates in different places. There is remarkably little agreement among scholars as to what precisely caused the rift and estimates vary about the date, from the middle of the first century CE to the middle of the fourth CE.
Professor Alan Crown from Sydney goes beyond the reserve of most scholars and dates "the parting of the ways" to the Council of Nicaea 325 CE, a date which I accept. The Council of Nicaea was called by the Emperor Constantine to settle some theological differences that were dividing his Christian Empire. The first act of the three hundred bishops assembled was to set a date for Easter distinct from the Jewish Passover thereby effectively separating Jews and Christians. (continued on the following web page.)
http://www.jcrelations.net/The+Parting+of+the+Ways.2237.0.html?L=3
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by RoyW on
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Amanda, you have managed to change the thrust of these comments but the other does seem to have stopped. I agree with LT that you cannot really know exactly what will happen in the future. After it happens, we will be able to see everything the Bible says is true. If one believes that Revelation does speak to the future we do see that a great portion of the population of the earth is killed during the terrible devastation that is coming upon this globe. At one point under the breaking of the seals one-fourth of the population is destroyed. Then under the sixth trumpet of terror another one-third is killed. After 0ne-fourth, three-fourths would be left. A third of that leaves 0ne-half. That still numbers into the billions. Others are killed but there are obviously people left on the globe at the coming of Christ. I personally believe the church will be taken off the earth before these terrible events but I tend to believe that these horrific events are very much towards the end of that seven year period which means I would be one that would think that the resurrection of the dead happens towards the end - not the beginning. I only find one resurrection at which time the church is taken along with all the those who will rise to meet Him in the air. What will happen to all those still on the earth?
Jesus does speak of a judgment that occurs at His coming:
Mt 25:31-35
31 "When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his throne in heavenly glory. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.
34 "Then the King will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. NIVThis is not a judgment for the believer since they are with Him as He returns. This is not the Great White Throne Judgment at the end of the 1000 years. Who are these sheep? This is a judgment of the nations as expressed which does indicate Gentiles. The sheep are called righteous. The timing as presented by Jesus indicates to me that this is after the resurrection of the dead. The goats are sent to eternal damnation but the righteous inherit the Kingdom which the church rules over. It does appear these are judged by their works. The righteous today are judged by their faith which we know is dead without works. But who is this group? Obviously, there are certain things we cannot answer about what is coming. We can speculate but it cannot be established with certainty. We know that all this is God's plan. I personally believe that He does have a people destined to be a part of the Kingdom that will repopulate the earth during the 1000 years. However, I would not choose a church based on whether or not they would agree with my ideas of the future. On the other hand I would not attend a church that did not believe in the resurrection and those in Christ remaining at that time being caught up with them. That is very much a part of my doctrine. What happens after that, I will certainly listen to what you have to say about that. When you say there will be people left, I would say you are probably correct but what happens to them when He returns I could only speculate about. Right now I am just too tired to reign with Him. I think I'll stay in my new house. But then, I guess our tiredness will be all gone at that point. It's going to be a great day. I am sorry for those who do not believe. I am with you and LT here. We just don't know everything about the future. He gives us glimpses.
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Permalink Reply by Amanda on
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Hey, Roy, this is an interesting reply and I think I like it. I will get back to you on it. My mind is working. Still. Whether that's good or bad, IDK :)
You said:
Amanda, you have managed to change the thrust of these comments but the other does seem to have stopped.
Do you just mean that I changed the course of the discussion? Or do you mean something else? The other what stopped?
Also, off-topic, but How about them Cats, huh? True Blue!!!
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Roy, yes very controversial and my mind cannot understand all of God's ways but I know whatever God wants to do is alright with me and God is just as well as (and thankfully) merciful and longsuffering and good. I am sorry for my Jewish friend--but while she breathes there is hope.
Many are blinded--both jew and gentile. All are born spiritually dead. Salvation on God's terms is the only way and that would be through Jesus--the Way, the Truth, and the Life.
The foundation of Christianity is the resurrection of Jesus Christ. I was just thinking about the empty tomb and we know the gate is small and the road is narrow (Matthew 7:14) but still there will be a "vast throng" who found that narrow way and a multitude will be raised from the dead because Jesus died and rose for them and they called on His name, as you said, and are saved.
I believe in Jesus. He is my Savior and my Lord. I grieve for the many who go out into eternity on the broad way. Today, how many will that be? But God is in control. It humbles me that God chose me as one of His own.
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Amanda,
I'm starting a new thread. I believe you are correct in your present belief that the rapture and the resurrection are synonymous terms. Also, let me say that I really don't have a view of the judgment of Matt. 25. I grew up in a very legalistic church and had to be delivered from the idea that we would be judged according to our works. If we were good enough we would make it, etc. I always felt like I was the goat. Now, I understand things differently. I just know that is not the judgment for the believer. Some believe this is a judgment of how we treated the Jew. I guess I don't think that but it is a good supposition. It is very apparent to me that it is after His second coming and prior to the millennial reign which I believe is futuristic. When He returns with His bride to reign for a millennium, there will quite obviously be those who survived the tribulation. Only He will be able to judge but there is a judgment of some kind. Are these sheep the ones God had planned all along to repopulate the earth? Does He plan to repopulate the earth? I have no doubt that there will be humans on this earth at least during the millennium. It just may be that He will get rid of the bad ones before the millennium. There will be another judgment following the millennium. After that, I don't know. What will happen to those who come through the millennium? Will they be mortal, immortal - I really don't think He wants us to worry about that. We have an eternity ahead of us. I encourage everyone to get on board. This is going to be a great ride. What He has planned for us in eternity - it is way beyond our imaginations.
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Roy,
I agree with your premise and repeat (agreeing) that much of the future is unknown to us, but it is completely in God's hands and under His control. In that we can be sure.
Something I have learned along the way is that we must always fight the urge to present a POV as fact and be honest enough to admit when we do not know something. At the same time not allow ourselves to be bulldozed over by those who think they do know something in the area where we do not ... (Hope that makes sense)
Lord Bless,
LT
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LT, I hope you do not think I was presenting my thoughts as facts. I said I don't know but "was thinking."
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Amanda,
Nope, not at all. I just like to try to be as clear as possible ... though at times, fail miserably :-)
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You bring a lot of clarity, LT. You don't give yourself enough credit. Many hooks in the water ... remember that.
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Roy, yes I now hold the POV that Rapture/Resurrection is synonymous and a pre-wrath trib. I realize you were just presenting an analysis of the Scripture of Matthew 25. I have not considered it in that light before--as you portrayed it. You said:
I just know that is not the judgment for the believer
It is easy to think that sheep in this Scripture would refer to believers and goats mean unbelievers. However, we know there are lost sheep as well. So the sheep here may be lost sheep but maybe they are given that second chance???
You said:
Are these sheep the ones God had planned all along to repopulate the earth? Does He plan to repopulate the earth?
I realize you have questions, too, and are musing as well as I am.
I imagine it's OK with God for us to do this ... talk like this ... about these sorts of things.
Then those who feared the LORD talked with each other, and the LORD listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the LORD and honored his name.--Malachi 3:16, NIV.
Just one other thought. Some will inherit the earth. Maybe the ones reigned over during the thousand years are the ones who barely escape through the flames--1 Cor 3:15???
In Matthew 25 is the parable of the ten virgins, too. I have heard it explained that the five represent the born again and the other five represent the ones who miss the Rapture.
I think we are still talking about the parting of the ways ... but in a different sense now :)
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Permalink Reply by Rita Cullimore on
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Ecclesiastes 12:7 says the spirit returns to the One Who gave it.
When Jesus was dying he said Father, receive my spirit. We know that Jesus preached in Sheol? and led captivity captive...to Heaven. I think that deals with the soul. Stephen, as he was dying, saw Jesus standing at the right hand of the Father. I think that deals with God receiving Stephen's soul.
So I think the breaking open of the tombs would be for the giving up of the body. The Revelation speaks of the sea giving up those in it. Again...body.
Jesus made the atonement for our souls through His death and resurrection. Therefore, the catching away would be the catching away of the body. "we who are alive..." will be taken bodily in the "snatching away". This will include all 3...spirit, soul, body.
Jesus preached to the Jews while H was here on earth. Paul frequently talks of the Jews being first in everything. Jesus said the "first shall be last". However, I don't think God has replaced the Jew with the Church. I think God will again turn His attention to them. The "Messianic Jew" is part of the church.
Blessings, Amanda.....
Rita
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Thanks, Rita.
When I was 12 I read the book called Raptured by Ernest Angley and it really scared me. It asks the questions, Will thousands of Christians literally disappear from the face of the earth, never again to be seen by the unrepentant? Will sinful humanity have to endure the reign of the beast before the full wrath of God falls upon them? Will hideous torture be inflicted upon people?
I guess it is not fair for me to say I have always believed in a pre-wrath trib. Long ago when first saved as a teenager I did hold the view of a pre-trib rapture. I think it was mainly because of reading Angley's book. I still have a copy of it. I didn't want to believe God would allow His children to endure hideous torture before being raptured. I thought maybe, if that was the only way people who missed the rapture could be saved, then it was justifiable.
Conversations with my dad after I was saved changed my mind about a pre-trib rapture. He believed in a pre-wrath rapture. Many will be martyred for their faith at that time.
Dad would say, "Now we have to be careful here. There's a warning you know." He believed the warning was Rev. 22:18-21.
However it plays out, we certainly need the grace of the Lord Jesus to be with us all.
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To understand the fact that God will fight for Israel, and that it will not be destroyed. one needs to study the 6 day war of 1967 when Israel whipped Egypt, Syria and I think Jordan. Amazing things happened in that short period of time that shows that God will defend Israel....that Israel will continue to exist. My favorite excerpt is where two sixteen year old Jewish boys, flying a piper cub, dropped a Molotov cocktail down the center stack of a Egyptian battle ship and blew it to smithereens. Another was a man , who was in Syria, who planted trees in certain areas that would show Israeli Air Force where to drop bombs.
God will not forsake Israel, and that is why we need to pray for her and defend her. God will not give up one her until the last soul is saved....and we shouldn't either. God will bless those that bless Israel and He will curse those who curse Israel.
Blessings...
Rita
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