All About GOD - Growing Relationships with Jesus and Others
Word of God (the Bible)
The Word of God (written or given Word) is a great blessing. We know that the gospel is the mechanism that God uses in harmony with the Holy Spirit to draw people unto salvation. According to Romans 10 they must hear the Word of Christ in order to be saved. The key is understanding the purpose of the Bible. We are blessed to have it, but Jesus is our goal and our Savior. I do not see the Bible and Jesus as equal. That does not diminish the Word of God. Both are good, but one is the Savior and the other is the tool used to guide us to Him and into a living relationship with Him.
Imagine for a minute. If you were faced with Jesus on your left and the written the Word of God on the right and your were given a choice to choose one, which would it be? Fortunately we do not have to choose, but we know that Jesus died for us, the Bible records it. Jesus' blood covers our sins, the Bible reveals it. Jesus is coming back to take us to be where He is, the Bible reveals this to us. One is a witness the other is the Savior. Here is another way of approaching this, I love Jesus and I greatly appreciate the Bible. One more approach, the Bible reveals Jesus and in some parts of the world people have heard the gospel and maybe a few more verses, they do not own a Bible as it may not even have been written in their language at this time, but many repent and come to Jesus because they heard the gospel. They have Jesus and yet only snippets of the written Word.
If every Bible you own was stolen and access to any other Bible denied would you be lost or still in a living relationship with Jesus? On the other side of the coin does owning a Bible assure one is saved?
I close with this. The Bible and Jesus are both good. Thank God you own a Bible, praise God that you are saved.
What's your take on this?
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Amanda on
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I am having trouble separating Jesus from the bible. In John 8, He says, 31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, 32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free" (ESV).
Jesus is Truth and His teachings are truth and where else do we find His word, in which we are to abide, if not the bible? I depend on the truth to set me free. How can I be a disciple if I doubt any of the bible as being God's Word and being of divine origin? I struggle to understand how to separate the two. I fear if I do this, then the doubts will truly take root and I'll soon accept that I can't trust it to be more than just words about God. I suppose it doesn't really matter. We are either His or lost. We can only go in one of two directions -- continue on in faith or fall away in doubt and none of His will be lost. So it's pointless to worry. I'm just being straight with you about it.
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Amanda,
I don't understand what you are saying. Where did I call it less than God's Word? Have I said anywhere that it is not God's Word or of divine origin?
Lord Bless,
LT
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No. You have plainly stated it is God's Word and inspired by Holy Spirit. I'm referring to the liberal POV of it being a word about God. I'm saying I'm afraid if I separate Jesus from the bible and it's teachings, I fear my weak faith will become weaker. I have relied very heavily upon the bible and I have viewed it as very important for helping my faith grow. I'm only having trouble with your one point that they are separate. That's all I'm saying and I'm not even saying your view on that one point is wrong. I'm trying to understand it better but I'm having trouble.
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Amanda,
You do not separate them. You put them in their proper place. It is not an either or, but both according to the plan of God, with each its purpose and fulfillment.
One is God one is not.
One is divine the other is of divine origin (God breathed).
Both are completely trustworthy.
One is the Savior and the other reveals the Savior.
Life in Christ requires the gospel and for us that is recorded in the inspired Word of God.
Lord Bless,
LT
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LT,
Something has been illuminated for me this morning. In John 16:1, I was comforted by what Jesus said there and throughout the chapter and realized that the reason we have the NT today is because the Holy Spirit inspired its writing and the same Spirit indwells each of us to strengthen us, comfort us, guide us, sustain us and also to bear witness of Jesus and His truth. Verse 1 says, “I have said all these things to you to keep you from falling away." I can trust Jesus to keep me from falling away. He has things under control. We also read this in the same chapter:
12 “I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. 13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all the truth, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to you the things that are to come. 14 He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to you. 15 All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to you. (ESV)
Thank you for being the light that God used to let these things become more illuminated for me. You see, I now understand that even though I depend upon the bible so much to read and study, it is clear to me that the Spirit Himself is in me, bearing witness of all the very same truths in the written words in the bible. This is how those who are born again in remote areas of the world and who don't have a bible to read and study will still grow and mature spiritually and still know and understand God's will.
I haven't been giving the Spirit proper recognition and acknowledgment. I think you may have discerned this but I wasn't aware of it. I felt I had grieved the Spirit so terribly three years ago when I gave up and quit church and quit my job and just wanted to die. I thought this is why I seldom feel the presence of God and even though I've prayed for forgiveness, He is still hurt because my progress has been so slow and so grievious to Him. Now, I see that He is with me and here and I must increase my awareness of Him. Somehow.
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Sounds like you are on the right track. May God give you wisdom in your walk with Him.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Amanda,
Cannot two things be true? One is truth and the Giver of truth. The other is truth and is the given truth.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Yes. The one is true because the other is the Way, the Truth, and the Life.
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Amanda,
Let's attempt to clear something up that you have stated a couple of times.
What are you dependent on the Bible for? Don't over think this, just simply respond from where you are right now.
I will be away for a bit, but will respond ASAP later today if you should respond quickly.
Lord Bless,
LT
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LT,
Thank you for the offer but there's really no need for further discussion. I have referred in the past to the bible as being one of God's "tools" and here is a link on AAG to a very recent comment where I made such a reference.
On July 23, 2013 I made this comment in a discussion in the Creation Science group:
"The bible is one of God's "tools" that explains the realities of life to us. In it's pages we learn what God is like."
http://www.allaboutgod.net/group/creationscience/forum/topics/my-op...
I've already explained what I mean when I say I depend on the bible. I said:
"When I say I depend on the bible, what I mean is I rely on the way God uses it to help me grow spiritually for it contains the counsel, wisdom, and guidance that Christians need. Since it is God's word and since Jesus is the bread of life, His words feed us and help us grow."
To which you replied:
"This is all true and you ought to thank the Lord that you have His Word to guide you."
I rely heavily on the bible because it contains truth. I know Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life. I'm not able to talk to Jesus face to face. I pray. I read the bible. I've always believed it is His words and not just a book of words about God. I don't have any kind of special experiences or visions, and I don't pray or speak in tongues amd I've never been so filled with the Spirit thay I might be accused of being drunk, but I just study the bible and attend worship sometimes.
I hope someday to see Jesus face to face. I seldom even feel God's presence. I do depend on the bible to keep me grounded in reality. Jesus quoted Scripture during the wilderness temptation. It helps me, too.
As you already know, my faith is weak. I have been doubting the bible. I remember once, quite awhile ago, I started a discussion about the apparent contradictions, but it's long been deleted as I've left the site many times. New discussions have been begun by other members about the topic since then and I've read through those comments.
I'm not being facetious and I'm not answering in anger. I'm being straight forward. I have argued for it being the Word of God very vehemently but deep down I have doubts at times and those doubts fuel the fight in me to remain in the belief that it is the Word of God and that it pleases God for me to believe it's God's Word. The fear has also been there that rejecting it as the Word of God would be rejecting Jesus, too.
Verses in the bible have assured me that I am saved and Holy Spirit has assured me as well even though I rarely feel His presence but there are moments when I do.
That's where I am right now. I tire of people seeing me as legalistic and a "Pharisee" and more liberal views are appealing since fundamentalists are frowned upon.
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Permalink Reply by ribbon on
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I know that what y'all are discussing here is WAY over my head but at the same time I think I should keep up with this discussion because I always had felt I couldn't get close to the lord because of the bible being so hard. I guess what I am trying to say is that maybe I must have been putting the bible in the same level as Jesus. I am confused as always but I hope to learn from this discussion by staying out of it but reading . Thank you LT for bringing the discussion to the forums.
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