All About GOD - Growing Relationships with Jesus and Others
Proverbs 18:21
Death and life are in the power of the tongue,
And those who love it will eat its fruit.
I would like thoughts on what this means to you.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Amanda on
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JB,
There are many who will disagree that believers have the ability to create reality with their words. It is true that words are very important and many people are tearing down fellow believers with their words, destroying what little faith they have and shaming them and taking away their hope in Jesus by making them feel like it is all on their shoulders and up to them to create their health and blessings and faith themselves. As I read your comment, Romans 5:5 came to my mind and recently God has asked me to make a stand against all things that would make me feel ashamed. The following is an excerpt from an article and I had a question in my head yesterday about mind renewal and this excerpt speaks about mind renewal and the whole article actually was very good.
"Sometimes a believer is living for the Lord, serving and honoring Him in all parts of his/her life. Over the years, the Lord blesses that person and they are happy, enjoy good health, etc. Certainly there is nothing wrong with enjoying the blessings of the Lord. But, it can all be taken in a moment, not because of spiritual problems, but because it may be that God is taking (or because of the situation He will take) that person to the next level of maturity—it is perplexing and it hurts. Often growth requires loss or brokenness. 24 Paul says, “…I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord for whom I have suffered the loss of all things…” (Phil. 3:8).
Romans 12:2 says, “And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.” Transformed in Greek is metamorphosis and means a change in form; it implies a struggle like when a chrysalis morphs into a butterfly. If we do not become changed from the inside-out—if we do not morph—we will be tempted to find external things to satisfy our needs. Transformation is not an instantaneous act of God, it is a life-long process (journey). One does not get transformed by just praying, asking or believing; there is no “microwave” (quick and easy) way to spiritual maturity.
The passive voice in Romans 12:2 means the Holy Spirit will do the transforming for us if we cooperate with Him (listening, yielding, relying…). Expect spiritual advancement, you can always mature more, Philippians 3:15-16. Your imperfections will be revealed by the Holy Spirit so that you may continue to grow and become more complete (not sinless, but well-rounded). Maturity versus infancy is the issue. God loves you just the way you are, but refuses to leave you that way; He wants you to be made conformable to Christ, II Corinthians 3:18.
Our Lord stripped himself of His glory and “…made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men…and became obedient unto death…” (Phil. 2:7 & 8). His life reminds us of our spiritual growth which often imposes tough lessons, sometimes so tough we shrink back from learning them. It seems we have to learn from actual experience that whatever we depend upon in this life (for joy, comfort, acceptance, etc.), ends up controlling us. God allows and uses life’s events to teach us about misplaced dependencies, so that we finally grasp the concept that Christ is our one true sufficiency."
http://new.bereanbiblesociety.org/overcoming-depression-biblically-...
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PS If you've never suffered from depression then I completely understand your inability to identify and empathize with those who do. At the same time God asks us to accept one another as Christ has accepted us and that means growing in love and compassion and understanding towards each other. That's what I'm working towards anyway with God' help.
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Permalink Reply by Tammy on
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Girl, I rarely do but the last couple of days have been killing me. I could stand on a mountain & rebuke it, curse it, holler & yell. I'm still depressed. lolol. So, I just keep my mouth closed & pray it goes away soon. I could not imagine dealing with it all the time like a few I know. I pray the Lord gives u some comfort Amanda cause I know you deal with a lot girl & I know your faith is strong. Don't allow other people's beliefs of how you SHOULD feel add to what you already feel. Just know I love you & the Lord totally understands.
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Permalink Reply by David Velasquez on
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JB,
>>It is when the Word becomes reality and not theory, that we can confess it and eat the fruit thereof.
Excellent word.
Thank you for taking the time to share. I appreciate you and love to see each of us grow as we continue to share. God uses AAG to help us learn how to communicate His wisdom.
I will only add one thing and the one thing I add here is not to diminish in any way what you have shared. I am in agreement with all you wrote and delight in it.
In my relationship with the Lord I have found that the Spirit guides me when I should have a supernatural confidence when declaring a thing to come to pass. I find that when the Spirit gives me that supernatural boldness to almost decreed a thing, is when I am asking about or dealing with kingdom business (Yes, I know, for us who are new creations/born again, all is kingdom business in one way or another). When I am asking for personal wants and needs God's Spirit leads me to pray as my Lord prayed - ...your will be done... Of course we know his will when we abide in Him and hence we can boldly declare a truth. :)
We are the children of God and our God is the best Father in existance.
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David, the Word of God is already reality. It is not a theory waiting to become reality or to be turned into reality once someone finally believes it and speaks it. This is my understanding anyway. I am very confused by many teachings that are in the church and the one saying we can create our own reality by positive confession is one of the teachings that I question. If it's biblical, then I certainly don't want to reject it. I worked with terminally ill patients for a time and there was a lady who used this method and kept stating that she was well and the cancer was gone but she still died. She had tears in her eyes when she took her last breath. I believe God is a good Father. I believe also that God's will doesn't always include health and material blessings. His will includes daily bread and daily needs met and to some He gives abundance but is that mercy or grace and are those people creating those gifts in their realities, in their lives? This goes back to my other question about when God keeps people safe and healthy, is it unmerited favor? God can do whatever He wants. I can't create a reality of perfect health and abundance for myself. I don't see how I can ever do that. I'd like to learn and maybe I just need to mature spiritually to that point. I don't know.
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That is an excellent catch Amanda and a necessary explanation needs to be posted to keep that statement a healthy one.
What I take the statement to mean and what I believe JB intended to communicate with it, is the fact that there is a humongous abyss between knowledge and application. Between what the word of God does and is in theory (purely head knowledge) and practical reality. The place where the word moves from the head to the heart, to the hands and feet, to the senses and way beyond.
The word of God is definitely already a reality, but is it a reality to you and to me and to _____?
Are we acting on it as it is a reality or are we acting on it as theory? I am confident and fully convince God's word is true, so I act on it and speak blessings and not curses for God's word has the ability to change things around for God's glory. I have spoken God's commands/will (being led by the Spirit) in a situation and the circumstances have changed at times immediately, at other times it has taken longer for me to see the fruit and yet at other times I conclude that had other purposes in mind. I have learned through that reality that I am to be content with Godliness for it is a great gain.
The problem is that some in the body have taken the authority/boldness God has gives us when we are being led by the Spirit of God and have turn it in a formula which ignores many of the "if's" included with the promises.
God is not our personal Genie as you know, I know you know this, but as usual I respond for the benefit of all. It is amazing that God has ministering angels at his command that keep us and His Spirit leads us to all truth etc etc... but He is not our personal servant, though it is incredible that God does wash our feet, yet it is all according to his good pleasure and will, NOT how many in the body bottle faith to be. There are no 123 steps or formula. There is the Spirit of God leading us and giving us the confidence/trust/faith to proclaim boldly God's command for any given time and situation.
You said: I believe also that God's will doesn't always include health and material blessings.
We are in agreement. God get's glory from infermities when we go through them holding on to him.
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David,
I will make one last comment and then I'm taking a break from the forums. My misgivings about the teaching that people can create their own reality come from the knowledge that it is a teaching of the New Age Movement. If I can create my own reality and you can create your own reality and so on and so on, then there are many realities and each reality differs for each person and truth becomes only relative with no absolutes.
Some of the teachings of new age religions have spilled over into the church and IMO those teachings should have no place in the Body of believers. We must be discerning. We must also remember that new believers aren't yet mature enough to discern some of these unbiblical teachings from what is actually Scripture and even the more mature believers are getting caught up in the deception.
"This is what the LORD says -- your Redeemer, who formed you in the womb: I am the LORD, who has made all things, who alone stretched out the heavens, who spread out the earth by myself" (Isaiah 44:24, NIV).
We all have different circumstances in our lives but those are all a part of the same reality. In reality of God's Word, some people are healed and some aren't, some people have many material blessimgs and some have few, some die young and some live to be a 100.
"Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows" (James 1:17, NIV).
Gifts are given to us, not created by us.
I also find in Scripture that Christ didn't require faith of everyone when He performed a miracle. The miracle that stands out most to me when I consider this truth, is the day when Jesus raised the son of the widow of Nain. She didn't seek Him or ask Him. She may not even have known who He was. It doesn't say. He just saw her and His heart went out to her. The boy was dead and in no position himself to be able to have faith.
Blessings to you, Brother.
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Very good post Amanda, you made my day beloved.
I appreciate your detail responses. Lately due to time restrains I have not been able to share in depth in the Forums, so I truly thank God for sound posts as yours is.
I hate the prosperity message that is taught today. It is another gospel. One that makes it ok for Christians to want and long for material things, the temptations Satan uses as idols against us. It is ok to want to have so we can bless others, but that is radically different from a gospel of greed.
There is no doubt that the new age movement influenced the teachers of the prosperity gospel. Our words create nothing. Our Lord is the only one that has the power to create from nothing. And we do not move the hands of God either in a way some believe.
However - what we say/express matter a lot. Our obedience is pleasing to the Lord. But at the end of the day and when all is said and done, God's good pleasure, holy and perfect will, will be done on His earth now and forever.
>>I also find in Scripture that Christ didn't require faith of everyone when He performed a miracle. The miracle that stands out most to me when I consider this truth is the day when Jesus raised the son of the widow of Nain.
Amen my sister! :)
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Thanks, David. Many seem to only want what they can get from Jesus. I want to give back to Jesus.
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Permalink Reply by Seek on
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Sorry, I have been off at a meeting today and just returned. I've read some very good responses to this so far from my phone and started making my own notes to how I wanted to address what you've said J.B.
God chose the weak and foolish. Even Job and Elijah suffered depression. And while it said Abraham never doubted, I have to ask where his head was when he took Sarah up on her offer of Hagar. Yet even in their depression and doubt, each saw the promises of God in their lives. God has a plan. Discouragement does NOT altar His plan and those who tear others down telling them this are not in Gods will to love...encourage, at the time those words are leaving their mouth.
While I understand your position and am sure God would rather we all think in positives, Joyce Meyers smoked and had a bad attitude and Charles Stanley wasn't even convinced God loved him, and yet this while both were preaching. God’s plan was not thwarted by their human weaknesses. Jesus came to bind up the broken hearted. God chose the weak and foolish. If one was depressed Jesus would say be of good cheer NOT that you will never see the goodness of the Lord unless and until you change your confession. If you confess that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you WILL be saved. That’s the confession. Confessing we’re healed when we don’t feel healed…I don’t see that as a requirement for God’s plan to come to pass.
God has told me:
You are beautiful
I love you
There is nothing wrong with you
You are growing
I WILL do.....this or thatMAN tells me:
You just said you are hurt so you will always have that confession. You said you struggle to pay bills therefore you will keep struggling because of stating what is going on now and God CAN’T (which is the most shocking...to limit God) ever do a thing for you.
I have been told this by those that preach the same message you have posted, and while there is nothing wrong with the message you posted and they preach, there IS something wrong in how it is wielded if one does not use discernment to understand what a person needs to build them up and…encourage one another just as you have been doing.
I have to believe my God is bigger than those who use these words to bring people down. I worship a loving all powerful God who fights my battles for me. To say if I ever get discouraged or doubt that Satan will keep pulling me down, that is to put Satan higher than God. Satan did nothing to Job without Gods approval. Satan can do nothing to me without God’s approval and my discouragement in long periods of trials and waiting does NOT thwart God’s plan for my life.
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