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justin martyr teachings
justin martyr provides the most damaging & systematic condemnation of GODS SABBATH & the first explicit account of christian worship. he taught on infant baptizing,that the law of moses was only temporary, that GOD had imposed HIS LAWS only on the nation of Israel , circumision,the seventh day sabbath & his holy sabbaths as punishment soley on them as a mark of their wickedness to single them out to other nations.he did not follow Jesus or the apostles teachings. the only (on record) was polycarp bishop of smyrna who was trained by the apostle John , ordained by the apostles & the only person recorded to have known john & the other apostles whom had known Jesus. a real living link between the apostles and second century church.letters were written of his faithfulness to the true teachings of the churche of Jesus. he lived by what apostle john and others disciples of jesus had handed down to him including the passover & feast of the unleaven bread..NOT easter .he even journeyed to rome to anicetus bishop in roman over keeping the jewish passover on nisan 14 as he was taught by john. he even stated to him the the ones who gave the teachings to him was john but still that did not change the bishop in romans mind .he passed all his teaching down to & they held fast to those teachings because even after he was martyred. he was also ordained by the apostles.
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Permalink Reply by Leonard T on
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Two questions:
1) Can you provide your sources for the above statements?
2) Have you read Polycarp's only survivng letter, the Letter to the Philippians?
Thanks,
LT
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Permalink Reply by delores kay napier on
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HI LT,
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yes at .......early christian writings "dialogue of trypho".... yes i have read it .....polycarp of smyrna the second century heretic fighter is more on him .the Roberts- Donaldson translation........ also polycrates of ephesus writes of him .... as you can tell i am still new on my p.c. skills bear with me.... hope this helps
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Tim,
First of all no one is suggesting that the writings of saints post Scripture are adding to our taking away from the Word of God. Reading the writings of early believers helps us understand what the church believed regarding the Scripture at that time. To ignore their writing would be a travesty. To elevate it to the value of Scripture would be sin.
Secondly, the Bible itself teaches on the subject of hell using various terms and descriptions of it through out the Word of God. This has been debated here many times and can be revisited again if need be.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Hey Tim,
Regarding your question on Gen. 3:19 I will reply with the following.
GE 3:19 By the sweat of your brow you will eat your food until you return to the ground, since from it you were taken; for dust you are and to dust you will return."
We have a physical body and are soul and spirit as well. The spirit did not come from the dust nor will it return to the dust. Therefore we must ask what happens at the death of the body?
2CO 5:8 We are confident, I say, and would prefer to be away from the body and at home with the Lord.
2CO 5:9 So we make it our goal to please him, whether we are at home in the body or away from it.
The key here is the recognition of the separation of the spirit from the body. The spirit of a believer goes to be with Christ. Where does the Spirit of the unbeliever go?
LK 16:20 At his gate was laid a beggar named Lazarus, covered with sores
LK 16:21 and longing to eat what fell from the rich man's table. Even the dogs came and licked his sores.
LK 16:22 "The time came when the beggar died and the angels carried him to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried.
LK 16:23 In hell, where he was in torment, he looked up and saw Abraham far away, with Lazarus by his side.
This parable/account adds two things. 1) The man did not cease to exist after physical death. 2) He is in hell. The next question is what is the next step in God's plan?
JN 5:28 "Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice
JN 5:29 and come out--those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned.
Here we see that the dead believer and unbeliever did not cease to exist. We also see that a time is coming when "both" will be given new bodies. This is often overlooked when people talk about spirits being burnt up, etc. The lost will be given a body to endure eternity in hell. The next question is what is the final destination for the lost?
REV 20:14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
REV 20:15 If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
The lost are placed in the Lake of Fire for etenity. What question arises next? The Bible proclaims that this is a second death. Let's analyize this. The first death did not cause cessation. The spirit still survived and eventually was called forth, given a body and judged. The is no reason to believe taht the second death means cessation anymore than the first death, which we already see is not the case at all.
I conclude with the following verse.
HEB 9:27 Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment,
Is the Bible in error? If a person dies and ceases to exist how can he face judgment. He can only face judment after death of the body if the spirit lives on.
Hope this helps and please feel free to inquire further.
Lord Bless,
LT
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There is no disharmony between the continuance of the soul/spirit and the death of the body. Did Moses die? Who do we see standing with Jesus at the time of His transfiguration? When you think of the soul and Adam, did Adam come from the dust or just his body? What did God breathe into Adam? The breath of life. The body returns to the soil, but the spirit lives on.
Hope this helps.
Lord Bles,
LT
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Hey Tim,
If a person only reads to Genesis 3:19 they will not have a full picture of any doctrine including creation as the creation account is illustrated in various places throughout Scripture. God gave revelation over a period of time and built upon the previous information as he revealed more to mankind until the Bible was finally completed and is now a completed book. The Word is to be taken as a the whole counsel of God comparing Scripture to Scripture.
Lord Bless,
LT
Lord Bless,
LT
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Tim,
It appears that you see death as cessation of the person. The Bible clearly teaches that life goes on without the flesh that returns to the dust. Let’s look at some examples.
Did Moses ever live?
Did Moses ever die?
Did Michael dispute with the devil over Moses’ body?
Who appeared with Jesus at His transfiguration?
If Moses was dead how can he be alive when the body was still in the grave?
Can a believer die?
If he dies is that a contradiction because the Word says we will live?
The Apostle James is proclaimed to have died, yet he was a believer. How can this be?
Jesus died, but did not cease to live in the spirit.
Paul talked of being a part from the body is to be at home with the Lord.
Do only believers continue after physical death?
What does the account of the rich man and Lazarus tell us?
What is death? What does David say in Psalm 49 regarding the body and the spirit?
Death has several meanings because we are made up of several parts. The body was formed from the dust and to the dust it will return. The spirit/soul is the breath of God within us and it never ceases to exist, but can experience spiritual death in that we are separated from God who is our true life.
What does Genesis 4:10 mean in light of Lev. 17:11-14 and Dt. 12:23?
We’ll stop there for now.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Hey Brother,
I would say "Brother there is so much more to God's Word than just the first three chapters of Scripture and a full understanding cannot be derived from just these verses. I think it is wonderful that you have begun your journey and are reading His Word. Let me help you to understand the meaning of life and death as presented in the whole of God's Word as we branch out and examine the various aspects relating to death and what it means in Scripture."
Lord Bless,
LT
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Hey Tim,
Then I would say we've got a big problem because I would think that in order for the Bible to be the Word of God, then it has to be without contradiction. The fact that you are unable or unwilling to answer my question tells me you think that what is presented in the first three chapters of Genesis gets contradicted in other parts of the Bible, and this would render the Bible unreliable and useless.
Not contradicted, but expanded understanding. One cannot understand portions of Scripture isolated without comparing it with the rest of Scripture. As previously stated, God's revelation was given over time and is now a completed work. Each additional piece does not contradict the previous, but expands on it. Within the various covenants made by God to man over the course of human history we do not find contradiction, but new information that expands on the previous information of the previous convenant(s). There is a difference between harmony of Scripture and isolation of a text to build a doctrine.
But if there's one thing the first three chapters of Genesis has taught me is that there is a God who created all things and accomplished so much and so wonderfully before there were human eyewitnesses. So the mere fact that we have the account of the creation of the earth and all that is on it, including man, tells me that the Bible is God's written word.
Excellent
So if He tells me that man was created out of the dust, "became a soul" and then returned to the dust at death, I'm going to take His word for it. The opposite of life is death. Adam became a soul; then he ceased to be a soul. I must believe that any scripture that comes after that has to harmonize with this concept. So I looked up Ezekiel 18:4 where it says that the "soul that sinneth, it shall die" and I see that that goes right along with what I read back in Genesis. I also see that in the book of Acts at chapter 3, verse 23 someone called Peter says this: "And it shall come to pass, [that] every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people." Once again, I can't argue with this because it goes along with what God said was Adam's punishment, becoming a destroyed or dead soul.
Genesis 2:7 states that God formed the man from the dust (his body) and then breathed the breath of life into his nostrils and he became a living being (Body, soul and spirit).
The Bible says that it is appointed unto to man to die once and then judgment. If death means only cessation how can one be judged? The Scriptures teach that man is more than body and that the body will die, but not the soul/spirit. John 5:28-29 talk about the resurrection of both the saved and the lost. The person did not cease, but only the flesh in which the breath of life existed ceased to have the life giving spirit within it.
Acts 3:23 uses compound words that the KJV has rendered as “soul” and “destroyed.” In the original language it conveys a different understanding than simply the soul and that of destruction. An alternative understanding is “Anyone” instead of soul and “cut off from” instead of destroyed. Though this is debatable to a degree it simply points out that it is not as clear as thought to be by the English words chosen by some versions.
Ezek. 18 deals with separation from God as He deals with the nation of Israel. Read verse 31 and 32. Put this into context with John 15 where we find the illustration of “The Vine.”
To be destroyed among the people deals with physical life and death, but not the cessation of existence.
I have a feeling that every scripture you've mentioned will have a reasonable and logical explanation that will not contradict what I've learned so far. I must look into this before my search for Truth ends.
You are on a journey and I trust God will guide you into the fullness of His truth as you seek to walk with Him.
I want to expand a little more on the concept of Gen. 3:19. You are holding to a sound method of interpretation, but stopping short of its full usage. Your are presenting the concept of “First Usage.” In first usage we see that the basic understanding is revealed and that all Scripture must align with it. The problem is that first usage lays the ground work and can be expanded on without contradiction. The death of the body is revealed in Gen. 3:19, but does not convey the effects to the soul or inner person (breath of life). These principles are revealed by God over time in the expansion of His Word. Not contradiction, but expansion of understanding.
Let’s use an example. The Messiah is prophesied about in Scripture. The first visual recognition is in Gen. 3:15. In Gen. 3:15 we do not see that Jesus was going to die on the cross as the Lamb of God. Though this first usage does not outline in detail all aspects it does not limit the truth of God’s Word as He lays it out in more detail over the course of time through further revelation found in His Word.
Do you believe in the resurrection of man? If so, what happens at the resurrection of man in your view? Is the resurrection portrayed in Genesis 1-3?
Lord Bless,
LT
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Hey Tim,
I noticed that you live about 25 miles from me. If you would like to do a face-to-face I would be more than happy to meet with you. I am in Gainesville. If interested let me know.
Also, I will be in your home town on March 14 speaking at a church presenting home missions.
Lord Bless,
LT
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Permalink Reply by Stacey Osana Arquines on
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Why even listen or read such things? just focus on living a life like Jesus Christ and loving God with all your heart mind and soul along with loving all the people around you. I understand your interest in Justin Martyr but if it tests your faith to think negatively of God or anything that is not good then avoid it. Stick with the word of God and good teachings. Yes question your faith but remain in the Holy Bible.
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