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DID SATAN KNOW ABOUT JESUS AND THE HOLY SPIRIT?
Do you think that satan knew about Jesus and the Holy Spirit when he (satan) was in heaven as one of the angels? I asked this because my thought is, if satan knew about Jesus and the Holy Spirit he wouldn't have tempted Jesus as accounted in the book of Mattew.
I guess God the Father didn't reveal the Son and the Holy Spirit to the angels because He knew about their disobident nature. He kept Jesus His only Son and the Holy Spirit His power, in His secret place knowing their time had not come. God knew that angles Micheal and Gabriel were strong enough to fight satan and his group of other disobident angels and chase them out of the heavenly kingdom. I think that when satan heard about Jesus Christ on earth, he had thought He was one of those claimers and he wanted to tempt Him with his useless offers.
What do you think?
Ede.
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Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Rod Askew on
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True David in regard to my meanderings not teaching us that the Word was in the appearance of man - that was not what I was trying to teach/write but was focusing more on the fact that satan does appear to have access to heaven's throne and is privy to some plans being carried out and can actually try to circumvent it so thus therefore he may have known that the Word was to become incarnate via the Holy Spirit immediately prior to it even taking place or well before. No scripture to prove it and I guess we will know in time when all will be know as it says in 1 Cor 13:12.
Just passing through David.......
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Permalink Reply by David Velasquez on
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Sis - I follow you and agree. It is possible he knew. Personally I highly doubt it, but it is possible. :)
I am sorry to hear you are just passing through.
Blessings beloved. -
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Beloved Ede,
We can also look at your question by asking this question: Did Jesus become the Son at the incarnation or was he always the Son?
Jesus’ human nature began at birth. Luke 1:35 says that the son of god began at birth. That term is about his nature, not his person, which is eternal. Verses like John 3:13 would say he has always been the "son of man"!!! But of course that is in person, not nature. Before incarnation he was the Word, the second person of the trinity.
John 1:15, in which John the Baptist explained "John testifies concerning him. He cries out, saying, "This was he of whom I said, 'He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.' “We find that Jesus was born after John the Baptist in which we also find that his statement "because he was before me" mentions that "Jesus, Son of God" has always existed. If that is the case, would that mean he was always the Son. How about the statement in John 8:58 in which Jesus mentions "before Abraham was, I Am" claiming that (Jesus) wasn't just claiming to have lived before the time of Abraham, but was claiming that he has always existed! These two verses are speaking of the "person" not the "nature" though.
John 3:13 “the son of man came down from heaven". He is talking about the “person" (which cannot be divided) not the "nature" (which cannot be confused or mixed).
I think that the relationship we see between the Father the Son and the Spirit, has for all eternity been that way. It did not just begin at the incarnation. However the term "son of god" (and only the term, not the divine person) began at his birth and is therefore referring to his human nature, according to Luke 1:35-38. I believe the term "son of god" is defined in those verses and refers to the human nature of Christ. As does the term "son of man", "Christ", "Jesus", etc. so in that sense, AND ONLY IN THAT SENSE, I am saying that the "son of god" (ONLY His human nature- NOT His divine person or HIs eternal nature) had a beginning.
I BELEIEVE IN ONE GOD IN THREE PERSONS- FATHER, SON AND HOLY SPIRIT!!!
Ok so Jesus for eternity has been the son of God, he was called the Word, but after He came to earth, He became the child of the Holy Ghost. Remember when He was baptized? God said" This is my Son..." Before that, he was not called the son of God, For He was GOD. They called him the Word.
But He came to earth, made himself of no reputation and became a man. And gained the title, "The Son of the Living God".
So with all the above in mind we can see that Jesus is the word and has been from eternity. Hence Lucifer was fully aware of Him and his presence. If Satan is aware of God, he is fully aware of the Word and the Holy Spirit. Satan knew about the word and the Holy Spirit, but not about Jesus, because Satan is not omniscient (all knowing). He did not know the Word would become flesh in the future. God is a Spirit, so Jesus was a Spirit who Satan did not recognized (probably as the Word). He did not have John 1:14 to tell him that the Word became flesh.
I hope I have helped and not confused you bro Ede.
Blessings
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Our God is a Triune God. He has always been a Triune God. Therefore, Satan would have always known He is a Triune God.
Satan presumed that he could convince Jesus to sin against the Father. There is strength for the opponent when seperation of persons on the other side. What Satan didn't count on was the fact that the Holy Spirit and the Father were still with Jesus during the temptation. The Father had to turn He face from the sight of his Son dying on the cross, because our sins were all over Him (Christ). When Christ was raised from the dead, the battle was all but finished, for Satan. When Christ comes back to earth He will *put icing on the cake*. He will handle Satan as Satan needs and deserves to be handled. The delay comes because of the others who will accept Christ before time is no more.
Rita
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Permalink Reply by Penny Toman on
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It is my understanding that Jesus was with God from the very begining of time. Jesus was with God when Satan decided to tempt Eve. I would guess that when Satan got the heave ho from our Lord he knew Jesus. Might not have known God's plan for Jesus but I really think he (Satan) knew Jesus in our Lord's home before human history began.
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Permalink Reply by RoyW on
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Bro. Ede,
I just now noticed your forum. I have read through the comments and they are very good. I think this last one by Penny is very good. I agree that Satan and Jesus had run-ins long before Jesus came to the earth as a man. God has a purpose for everything. He says:
Isa 46:10
10 I make known the end from the beginning,
from ancient times, what is still to come.
I say: My purpose will stand,
and I will do all that I please. NIV
God knows the beginning to the end. He created the angels for a very particular reason. He knew the outcome of Lucifer just as well as He knew the outcome of man. Adam was given a free will. He chose to disobey. God knew in the beginning he would do that. It was necessary for Satan to tempt Adam. God's people have to be tried and tested. Adam fell. Was God surprised? Absolutely not! God knew before He ever made man that man would fall. It was His purpose all along to redeem man and gain for Himself a family which you and I are a part of.
There are things about God's plan that are difficult for us to understand but we do know His plan is perfect. Those things we question today will become known when we finally see Him. Penny is right. Jesus knew in the Garden of Eden that some day He and this rascal would come face to face when Jesus would become a man. Jesus was tempted in the wilderness but it didn't stop there. Perhaps the greatest temptation would be to come down off of that cross. I don't know but we know that He was tried and tempted beyond normal bounds and never failed one time.
It was necessary for Satan to tempt Christ. I don't believe he had a choice in the matter. Satan does not have an ounce of freedom more than God gives Him. Satan has flexed his muscles and found he is no match for God. He knows his destiny. The demons cry out, "Mt 8:29... "Why are you interfering with us, Son of God? Have you come here to torture us before God's appointed time?" NLT
Yes, those fallen angels know their destiny. They are full of hate and enjoy seeing people fall but their joy is only temporary as they are destined for hell.
Do you see what the demons called Jesus? They called Him the Son of God. They knew who He was. When Satan came to test Jesus in the wilderness, he knew who Jesus was. Notice what he said to Him:
Mt 4:1-11
4 Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the desert to be tempted by the devil. 2 After fasting forty days and forty nights, he was hungry. 3 The tempter came to him and said, "If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread."
4 Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.' "
5 Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. 6 "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down. For it is written:
"'He will command his angels concerning you,
and they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.' "
7 Jesus answered him, "It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.' "
8 Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. 9 "All this I will give you," he said, "if you will bow down and worship me."
10 Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.' "
11 Then the devil left him, and angels came and attended him. NIV
Did Satan actually believe he had a chance with Jesus? I'm not sure but I don't believe he had a choice of whether to tempt Jesus or not. With Job Satan was restricted. With Jesus there were no restrictions. Satan was allowed to unleash all his fury on this beautiful One. Satan knew who he was dealing with. He also knew this was the One that was going to do him in. Maybe he thought he could deter Him. I don't know. I do know he had no choice but to give Jesus his best shot. He unloaded everything he had yet Jesus did not succumb even once. This was necessary for Jesus to become our perfect sacrifice and actually be Lord.
One day Jesus will return and bind that serpent for a 1,000 years. All creation will be singing on that day.
Concerning that perfect plan of God: Brother Ede, you and I are a part of that plan. All this has happened for us. We also must be tempted but we will come through with flying colors since Jesus has blazed the way for all of His brothers.
I appreciate your forum but I think you are just giving us a chance to give praise and glory to our wonderful Savior and Master.
Are you still in London or are you back home in Enugu? Great job!
Your brother, Roy
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Permalink Reply by Mr. Ede on
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Dear Roy,
It's all glory to God. I am still in London. Can I call you?
Ede.
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Raj,
You may be right in a sense. Did God create evil? I know Isaiah tells us that He did but I think that is in the area of natural disasters. The KJV says:
Isa 45:7
7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. KJV
The NIV States:
Isa 45:7
7 I form the light and create darkness,
I bring prosperity and create disaster;
I, the Lord, do all these things. NIV
But, we understand light because there is darkness. We understand good since there is evil. God is good and Satan is evil. He certainly created Him with the capacity for evil. I also agree this fit right into His plan. The children of God must be tried and tested. Faith is our key to salvation.
Isa 48:10
10 Behold, I have refined thee, but not with silver; I have chosen thee in the furnace of affliction. KJV
Raj, this verse fits in very well with your comments above. I think your comment would make another really good discussion. However, it might get a little heated as there would be quite a bit of diversity on the subject.
The Lord Bless and Keep you,
Roy
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Raj,
Satan is a defeated foe. His days are number. Yeap he is powerful in comparison to our human capabilities and very crafty. He is evil, proud and a liar. For now he is the prince of this world.
Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me (John 14:30).
Satan tempted Jesus because he did not know he was God in the flesh, the Word made flesh. If not why test the one that owns everything, even his existence as Lucifer (before his fall). Why temp God with what is his? This world does not belong to Satan, the current world system is of the devil and that liar could not conceive that God, the maker of heaven and earth, would do something he himself would never do. How can God (UNHEARD OF BY ANY OTHER MANMADE gods) come and die for His creation. That murderer could not conceive the Lord of lords would do that. How could it be possible that God die for His creation, which He can extinguish with a word? Many people look at God and Satan to be in a war haahahaha nothing could be further from the truth, that fallen angel has nothing coming. God doesn't even fight Him hahaha ohh he would not last a fraction of a second. God equips us to fight. There is no fight between God and a fallen angel. It would be like an ant fighting us, that comparison doesn’t do it justice either. God sustains life, anyways I am going down a tangent here, so let me stop.
Greater love no man has conceived or experience. Only our God our savior is WORTHY OF ALL PRAISE.
>>I personally think that Satan and the devils were created to test and tempt us away from God and see who perseveres and who gives up the race.
The question of the origin of evil is one of the most extensive topics to get into and one of the most difficult questions to answer. I will only say the following:
In God there is no evil or shifting of shadow. He is Holy, Holy, Holy. He created holy angels and a perfect couple in Adam and Eve. He created them intelligent with the capacity to reason and with the freedom of choice.
Lucifer then used his intelligence and ability to reason to choose to rebel and so did we in Adam. God is not the author of evil, but He willed evil to exist in an indirect way for now, for it serve his purposes and good pleasure for now. If God did not will evil to exist, evil would not exist. In his permissive will and for his purposes he allowed evil to exist.
Blessings
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Raj and David,
This discussion has much merit and one I would really like to get into. However, where do we engage into this one? My somewhat Calvinistic side is just itching to get going on this. Already, I have seen some that have become extremely upset over some of the things we talk about when we get to talking about the absolute sovereignty of an all-powerful God. God is absolutely in charge of everything in this universe. I agree there is no battle going on here. Everything is just playing itself out. That doesn't at all take away from this limited freedom that man has. It doesn't even take away Satan's limited freedom. But, when God says, "That's enough," my friend, it is all over. The believer never has to be in suspense over the great battle or over his own battles for that matter. WE ARE GOING TO WIN!
I sometimes wonder if we realize just how powerful God is. Consider the word "universe." Universe means a single spoken sentence. Now, if you go onto the internet and ask for a definition of universe you will get quite a differing meaning. But, the word 'uni" means single and note the definition of "verse" in the 1913 Webster's:
1. A line consisting of a certain number of metrical feet (see Foot, n., 9) disposed according to metrical rules. [1913 Webster]
In other words, Genesis one. Our God is way beyond human understanding. Obviously, even Lucifer himself didn't completely understand Him. Yet, this discussion would give us some insight to God and even into Jesus Himself. Did Satan know who Jesus was? He didn't have complete knowledge but he certainly DID know that he was dealing here with no ordinary man. Did he know He was the Son of God? I think he did.
The dialogue between Satan and Jesus brings up another good discussion: "But, when did Jesus realize He was the Son of God?" A hint, of course, would be the occasion at the age of twelve already about His Father's business. Well, anyway, I have to think that Satan was well aware of Who he was dealing with. Did God trick the enemy by not revealing to him that Jesus was incarnate God? It is possible that he didn't realize that. However, that would tell us that he didn't do his homework and read the Word since the Word reveals that this person would be the Mighty God and Everlasting Father. He may have missed that one about this child that was to be born but I really don't think so. However, I think he was focused on this one:
Zec 13:7
7 "Awake, O sword, against my shepherd,
against the man who is close to me!"
declares the Lord Almighty.
"Strike the shepherd,
and the sheep will be scattered,
and I will turn my hand against the little ones. NIV
There are some wonderful discussions here all just waiting to break out. Who started this one? I can't remember but great job. It is always a wonderful thing to talk about our Almighty Father. Knowing He is our Father has to be the most comforting knowledge in this entire universe (spoken sentence).
By the way, those who lean to the Calvinistic side are not the only ones that greatly enjoy speaking about the sovereignty of God.
Blessed be the Lord our God! Amen!
Roy
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Indeed Raj,
Jesus is Special, Amen He sure is. His disciples had the same authority to heal and cast out demons just like us. In my opinion Satan did not know, but in reality I am not 100% sure we can know that with absolute certainty.
Blessings.
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